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{{Talk header|search=yes|archive_age=90|archive_units=days|archive_bot=Lowercase sigmabot III}}
{{Talk header|search=yes}}
{{American English}}
{{American English}}
{{Notice|Various sections in this article may refer to either a team's total ''National Football League'' championships, or their total ''Super Bowl'' championships. Please remember that these values are different because the NFL's first season was held in 1920, several decades before Super Bowl I was played at the end of the 1966 regular season. Thank you.}}
{{Notice|Various sections in this article may refer to either a team's total ''National Football League'' championships, or their total ''Super Bowl'' championships. Please remember that these values are different because the NFL's first season was held in 1920, several decades before Super Bowl I was played at the end of the 1966 regular season. Thank you.}}
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{{WikiProject American Football League|importance=Top}}
{{WikiProject American Football League|importance=Top}}
{{WikiProject American football|importance=Top}}
{{WikiProject American football|importance=Top}}
{{WikiProject Sports|importance=Top}}
{{WikiProject Sports}}
{{WikiProject United States|importance=High}}
{{WikiProject United States|importance=High}}
}}{{section size}}
}}
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{{Spoken Wikipedia request|Catfurball|Important}}
{{Spoken Wikipedia request|Catfurball|Important}}


{{old move|date=3 March 2024|destination=NFL|result=All articles except main article and timeline article moved.|link=Special:Permalink/1214640675#Requested move 3 March 2024}}
== Removal of accessibility features ==

{{Ping|Toa Nidhiki05}} I'm asking the question again with no agenda or assumption or aggression: did you read the pages that I directed you to in my edit summary or not? As for BRD, we are ''required'' to have these accessibility features on ''every'' data table. I'm not required to get consensus for adding them to the literal millions of tables on Wikiepdia on a case-by-case basis: they ''all'' need them. Why would you remove the row scopes? How is that as accessible as before? ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 14:51, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
:I have read the pages before, dude. I literally said I was making edits to address your concerns. I am not sure why you are so caught up on accusing me of not reading pages. My entire complaint is that your edit created a gigantic ugly, colored "League" column at the end of the table that looks '''''terrible'''''. I don't have any issue with accessibility, but I have issue with you adding a gigantic ugly column on an already bloated table. That's why I tried to find a better solution, which you ''immediately reverted'' while claiming BRD (when ''you'' were the initial editor). If you don't want your edit changed in any way, just say it so I can stop wasting my time trying to fix the aesthetic problem. '''[[User:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Toa</i>]] [[User talk:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Nidhiki05</i>]]''' 14:56, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
::I'm not accusing you of not having read them. I am now asking why since you knew that all tables need these features, you removed them. How is that a good thing? Also, please don't make aggressive bad faith assumptions that I "don't want your edit changed in any way". I disagree that there is an aesthetic problem in the first place. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 14:58, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
:::I've already answered this. Can you answer my question - are you open to ''any'' edit that doesn't keep 100% of what you changed to the table formatting? Because it seems like you are extremely committed to it looking like this forever and are willing to edit war over it. '''[[User:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Toa</i>]] [[User talk:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Nidhiki05</i>]]''' 15:00, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
::::You have not answered the question: "How is removing accessibility features a good thing?" As I just tacitly answered, of course I am, but edits should have proper semantics, e.g. for things like definition lists. So now that I have answered your question, please answer my questions that you have not answered. Once again: "Why would you remove the row scopes? How is that as accessible as before?" ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 15:03, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
:::::There's already a definition list. It's at the bottom of the table, and it has been there for years. All you did was add a second, redundant list that looks poorly formatted. If the table looks like this, would you not revert it? '''[[User:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Toa</i>]] [[User talk:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Nidhiki05</i>]]''' 15:09, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
::::::That does not answer my questions and it is not a definition list. Look at the HTML in your edit: [https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Element/dt does it have a dt tag]? Please answer this question and my former ones which you have not answered. I answer your questions, so I'm hopeful you will answer in good faith and not insert things into tables that are non-tabular data. It is not appropriate to add a row that includes miscellaneous information that is not the scope of the table: that is why key/item pairs for definition lists exist in the first place. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 15:24, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
:::::::Would this be an appropriate substitute for you key, or do you demand the unformatted key stay as well? '''[[User:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Toa</i>]] [[User talk:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Nidhiki05</i>]]''' 15:29, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
::::::::You have (objectively) ''again'' ignored my questions and (subjectively, based on my perspective of the function of a table) ''again'' abused a table for non-tabular data. This is why key/item pairs for definition lists exist in the first place. This would certainly be much better and semantically much more meaningful than making a row of random information. Still waiting for your answers to my many questions that you've ignored. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 15:39, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::Your "definition list" looks terrible. It's unformatted, and I've never seen anyone demand anything like it on any other page on this website. I think it's abundantly clear at this point you aren't willing to actually discuss your edit, and you're willing to edit war to defend it - and that's deeply unfortunate. That also means this discussion is probably a complete waste of time - I'm not willing to engage in an edit war over this, but if your edit is reversed or modified (and it likely will be), I would highly advise you to follow [[WP:BRD]]. '''[[User:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Toa</i>]] [[User talk:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Nidhiki05</i>]]''' 15:43, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::I have no problem with formatting it. I'm concerned about its semantics, not its style. You can do amazing things with CSS. Still waiting for you to answer my many questions. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 15:44, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::::I'm not answering your questions because they essentially amount to "why do you hate blind people" and "why do you think accessibility is bad". If you want me to answer questions, ask better questions. I've tried to address your concerns, but you aren't budging an inch on anything, which again, leads to my conclusion that you ''aren't actually interested in discussing your edit'' or changing it in any way. I can't reason with that. '''[[User:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Toa</i>]] [[User talk:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Nidhiki05</i>]]''' 15:51, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::::That is not true. It is a very simple question to ask why you removed the row scopes. I have no clue why you would do that. Can you please explain why you did? I am also completely fine with whatever styling you want: that seems to be your primary concern, so I don't know why you're misrepresenting my position. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 16:00, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
{{outdent|:::::::::::::}}It seems in the latest edit, Toa has restored the row scopes. We should probably move on from that.<br>
How about we put the definition list at the bottom of the table, replacing the key? IMO it looks about the same and is way easier to understand [[:User:Aaron Liu|<span style="color: rgb(6,69,173); text-decoration: inherit;">Aaron Liu</span>]] ([[User talk:Aaron Liu#top|talk]]) 13:39, 21 November 2023 (UTC)

:Seems reasonable to me. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 20:04, 21 November 2023 (UTC)
:Wait--do you mean as part of the table itself? No, it's not tabular data and it ''is'' a definition list. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 19:34, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
::Hmm... on second thought, putting it before the table is also a lot better because for people who use un-advanced screen readers they can hear the key before reading the table.{{pb}}I don't really know what to do with the looks of the definition list. 🤷 [[:User:Aaron Liu|<span style="color: rgb(6,69,173); text-decoration: inherit;">Aaron Liu</span>]] ([[User talk:Aaron Liu#top|talk]]) 20:08, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
:::What is the problem with the looks? ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 22:29, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
::::it looks very separated from the table, but either way its not a big deal. [[:User:Aaron Liu|<span style="color: rgb(6,69,173); text-decoration: inherit;">Aaron Liu</span>]] ([[User talk:Aaron Liu#top|talk]]) 22:34, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

{| class="wikitable plainrowheaders" border="1"
|+ Key
|-
! scope="col" style="width:75px" | Symbol
! scope="col" style="width:450px" | Meaning
|-
! scope="row" style="text-align:center;"| '''* '''
| Club has relocated at some point in its existence
|-
! scope="row" style="text-align:center;"| '''†'''
| Club was a founding member of the NFL
|-
|}

{| class="wikitable sortable plainrowheaders"
|+ National Football League (NFL) clubs
! scope="col" | Conference
! scope="col" | Division<br><ref name="Teams">{{cite web|url=http://www.profootballhof.com/history/teams.aspx|title=Teams|publisher=[[Pro Football Hall of Fame]]|access-date=February 1, 2013|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20130110004535/http://www.profootballhof.com/history/teams.aspx|archive-date=January 10, 2013|url-status=live|df=mdy-all}}</ref>
! scope="col" | Club<br><ref name="Teams" />
! scope="col" | City
! scope="col" | [[List of current National Football League stadiums|Stadium]]<br><ref name="NFL stadiums go from boom to swoon in span of a decade">{{cite news|last=Breer|first=Albert|title=NFL stadiums go from boom to swoon in span of a decade|url=http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82a5c85c/article/nfl-stadiums-go-from-boom-to-swoon-in-span-of-a-decade|publisher=NFL Enterprises|website=NFL.com|date=July 6, 2012|access-date=February 1, 2013|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20130131081855/http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82a5c85c/article/nfl-stadiums-go-from-boom-to-swoon-in-span-of-a-decade|archive-date=January 31, 2013|url-status=live|df=mdy-all}}</ref>
! scope="col" | Capacity
! scope="col" | First<br>season<br><ref name="History of NFL franchises, 1920–present">{{cite web|url=http://www.profootballhof.com/history/stats/franchises.aspx|title=History of NFL franchises, 1920–present|publisher=[[Pro Football Hall of Fame]]|access-date=February 1, 2013|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20130102074644/http://www.profootballhof.com/history/stats/franchises.aspx|archive-date=January 2, 2013|url-status=live|df=mdy-all}}</ref>
! scope="col" | [[List of current National Football League head coaches|Head<br>coach]]
|-
!rowspan="16"|[[American Football Conference]]
!rowspan="4"|[[AFC East|East]]
|scope="row"|'''[[Buffalo Bills]]'''
|[[Orchard Park (town), New York|Orchard Park, NY]]
|[[Highmark Stadium (New York)|Highmark Stadium]]
|71,608
|{{dts|1960}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>{{dts|1970}} (NFL)
|[[Sean McDermott]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Miami Dolphins]]'''
|scope="row"|[[Miami Gardens, FL]]
|[[Hard Rock Stadium]]
|64,767
|{{dts|1966}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>{{dts|1970}} (NFL)
|[[Mike McDaniel]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[New England Patriots]]'''
|[[Foxborough, MA]]
|[[Gillette Stadium]]
|65,878
|{{dts|1960}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>{{dts|1970}} (NFL)
|[[Bill Belichick]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[New York Jets]]'''
|[[East Rutherford, NJ]]
|[[MetLife Stadium]]{{refn|The [[New York Jets]] and [[New York Giants]] share [[MetLife Stadium]].<ref name="Preparations Different for a Home-and-Home Contest">{{cite news|last1=Borden|first1=Sam|last2=Shipigel|first2=Ben|title=Preparations Different for a Home-and-Home Contest|url=https://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/23/sports/football/for-giants-jets-game-metlife-stadium-preparations-differ.html?pagewanted=all&gwh=666EA26DA54701B00BE45152395290F4|newspaper=[[The New York Times]]|date=December 22, 2011|access-date=February 2, 2013|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20130512190739/http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/23/sports/football/for-giants-jets-game-metlife-stadium-preparations-differ.html?pagewanted=all&gwh=666EA26DA54701B00BE45152395290F4|archive-date=May 12, 2013|url-status=live|df=mdy-all}}</ref>|group=upper-alpha|name=b}}
|82,500
|{{dts|1960}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>{{dts|1970}} (NFL)
|[[Robert Saleh]]
|-
! rowspan="4"|[[AFC North|North]]
|scope="row"|'''[[Baltimore Ravens]]'''*
|[[Baltimore|Baltimore, MD]]
|[[M&T Bank Stadium]]
|71,008
|{{dts|1996}}{{refn|Due to an agreement with the city of [[Cleveland]] as part of the [[Cleveland Browns relocation controversy]], the Browns name, colors, and team history/records were left in Cleveland, while the team, personnel, and staff were allowed to move to Baltimore what was considered a new franchise.<ref name="Deal clears NFL path to Baltimore">{{cite news|last=Morgan|first=Jan|title=Deal clears NFL path to Baltimore|url=http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/bal-modell020996,1,2346653.story?page=2|newspaper=[[The Baltimore Sun]]|date=February 9, 1996|access-date=February 1, 2013|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20120901195924/http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/bal-modell020996,1,2346653.story?page=2|archive-date=September 1, 2012|url-status=live|df=mdy-all}}</ref> As such, the Ravens are considered to have begun play in [[1996 Baltimore Ravens season|1996]] while the current Cleveland Browns are considered to have been founded in 1946, joined the NFL in [[1950 NFL season|1950]], became inactive from 1996 to 1998, and resumed play in 1999.<ref name="History of NFL franchises, 1920–present" /><ref name="Rival Pittsburgh gives Cleveland a brutal welcome in 43-0 drubbing">{{cite web|url=http://www.cleveland.com/brownshistory/plaindealer/index.ssf?/browns/more/history/19990912BROWNS.html|title=Rival Pittsburgh gives Cleveland a brutal welcome in 43–0 drubbing|last=Gossi|first=Tony|date=September 12, 1999|newspaper=[[The Plain Dealer]]|access-date=February 1, 2013|url-status=dead|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20130513014517/http://www.cleveland.com/brownshistory/plaindealer/index.ssf?%2Fbrowns%2Fmore%2Fhistory%2F19990912BROWNS.html|archive-date=May 13, 2013}}</ref>|group=upper-alpha|name=c}}
|[[John Harbaugh]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Cincinnati Bengals]]'''
|[[Cincinnati|Cincinnati, OH]]
|[[Paycor Stadium]]
|65,515
|{{dts|1968}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>{{dts|1970}} (NFL)
|[[Zac Taylor]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Cleveland Browns]]'''
|[[Cleveland|Cleveland, OH]]
|[[Cleveland Browns Stadium]]
|67,895
|{{dts|1946}} ([[All-America Football Conference|AAFC]])<br>{{dts|1950}} (NFL)<ref name="c" group="upper-alpha" />
|[[Kevin Stefanski]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Pittsburgh Steelers]]'''
|[[Pittsburgh|Pittsburgh, PA]]
|[[Acrisure Stadium]]
|68,400
|{{dts|1933}}
|[[Mike Tomlin]]
|-
! rowspan="4"|[[AFC South|South]]
|scope="row"|'''[[Houston Texans]]'''
|[[Houston|Houston, TX]]
|[[NRG Stadium]]
|71,995
|{{dts|2002}}
|[[DeMeco Ryans]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Indianapolis Colts]]'''*
|[[Indianapolis|Indianapolis, IN]]
|[[Lucas Oil Stadium]]
|63,000
|{{dts|1953}}
|[[Shane Steichen]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Jacksonville Jaguars]]'''
|[[Jacksonville, FL]]
|[[EverBank Stadium]]{{refn|The [[Jacksonville Jaguars]] began playing one home game each season at [[Wembley Stadium]] in London, England in 2013, and will continue to do so through 2020. In 2020, the Jaguars were originally scheduled to play two home games at Wembley Stadium, but the plans were cancelled due to the [[COVID-19 pandemic]].<ref name="Jacksonville Jaguars to play four NFL 'home' games at Wembley">{{cite news|url=https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2012/aug/21/jacksonville-jaguars-nfl-wembley|title=Jacksonville Jaguars to play four NFL 'home' games at Wembley|last=Pengelly|first=Martin|date=August 21, 2012|work=[[The Guardian]]|access-date=February 1, 2013|location=London|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20140107124541/http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2012/aug/21/jacksonville-jaguars-nfl-wembley|archive-date=January 7, 2014|url-status=live|df=mdy-all}}</ref><ref name="Jaguars at Wembley through 2020" /><ref name="Jacksonville Jaguars to host regular-season game in United Kingdom in each of next four years">{{cite news|title=Jacksonville Jaguars to host regular-season game in the United Kingdom in each of next four years|url=http://www.jaguars.com/news/article-JaguarsNews/Jacksonville-Jaguars-to-host-regular-season-game-in--United-Kingdom-in-each-of-next-four-years/999e3874-69c5-4ae6-933e-b1ea28fb4559|publisher=Jacksonville Jaguars|website=Jaguars.com|date=August 21, 2012|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20150919151830/http://www.jaguars.com/news/article-JaguarsNews/Jacksonville-Jaguars-to-host-regular-season-game-in--United-Kingdom-in-each-of-next-four-years/999e3874-69c5-4ae6-933e-b1ea28fb4559|archive-date=September 19, 2015|access-date=December 31, 2018|url-status=dead}}</ref>|group=upper-alpha|name=d}}
|67,814
|{{dts|1995}}
|[[Doug Pederson]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Tennessee Titans]]'''*
|[[Nashville, Tennessee|Nashville, TN]]
|[[Nissan Stadium]]
|69,143
|{{dts|1960}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>1970 (NFL)
|[[Mike Vrabel]]
|-
! rowspan="4"|[[AFC West|West]]
|scope="row"|'''[[Denver Broncos]]'''
|[[Denver|Denver, CO]]
|[[Empower Field at Mile High]]
|76,125
|{{dts|1960}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>1970 (NFL)
|[[Sean Payton]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Kansas City Chiefs]]'''*
|[[Kansas City, Missouri|Kansas City, MO]]
|[[Arrowhead Stadium|GEHA Field at Arrowhead Stadium]]
|76,416
|{{dts|1960}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>1970 (NFL)
|[[Andy Reid]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Las Vegas Raiders]]'''*
|[[Paradise, Nevada|Paradise, NV]]
|[[Allegiant Stadium]]
|65,000
|{{dts|1960}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>1970 (NFL)
|[[Antonio Pierce]]
(interim)
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Los Angeles Chargers]]'''*
|[[Inglewood, California|Inglewood, CA]]
|[[SoFi Stadium]]<ref group=upper-alpha name=f />
|70,240
|{{dts|1960}} ([[American Football League|AFL]])<br>1970 (NFL)
|[[Brandon Staley]]
|-
!rowspan="16"|[[National Football Conference]]
!rowspan="4"|[[NFC East|East]]
|scope="row"|'''[[Dallas Cowboys]]'''
|[[Arlington, Texas|Arlington, TX]]
|[[AT&T Stadium]]
|80,000
|{{dts|1960}}
|[[Mike McCarthy]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[New York Giants]]'''
|[[East Rutherford, New Jersey|East Rutherford, NJ]]
|[[MetLife Stadium]]<ref group=upper-alpha name=b />
|82,500
|{{dts|1925}}
|[[Brian Daboll]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Philadelphia Eagles]]'''
|[[Philadelphia|Philadelphia, PA]]
|[[Lincoln Financial Field]]
|69,176
|{{dts|1933}}
|[[Nick Sirianni]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Washington Commanders]]'''*
|[[Landover, Maryland|Landover, MD]]
|[[FedExField]]
|62,000
|{{dts|1932}}
|[[Ron Rivera]]
|-
! rowspan="4"|[[NFC North|North]]
|scope="row"|'''[[Chicago Bears]]'''*†
|[[Chicago|Chicago, IL]]
|[[Soldier Field]]
|61,500
|{{dts|1920}}
|[[Matt Eberflus]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Detroit Lions]]'''*
|[[Detroit|Detroit, MI]]
|[[Ford Field]]
|65,000
|{{dts|1930}}
|[[Dan Campbell]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Green Bay Packers]]'''
|[[Green Bay, WI]]
|[[Lambeau Field]]
|81,441
|{{dts|1921}}
|[[Matt LaFleur]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Minnesota Vikings]]'''
|[[Minneapolis|Minneapolis, MN]]
|[[U.S. Bank Stadium]]
|66,860
|{{dts|1961}}
|[[Kevin O'Connell (American football)|Kevin O'Connell]]
|-
! rowspan="4"|[[NFC South|South]]
|scope="row"|'''[[Atlanta Falcons]]'''
|[[Atlanta|Atlanta, GA]]
|[[Mercedes-Benz Stadium]]
|71,000
|{{dts|1966}}
|[[Arthur Smith (American football, born 1982)|Arthur Smith]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Carolina Panthers]]'''
|[[Charlotte, North Carolina|Charlotte, NC]]
|[[Bank of America Stadium]]
|75,523
|{{dts|1995}}
|[[Frank Reich]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[New Orleans Saints]]'''
|[[New Orleans|New Orleans, LA]]
|[[Caesars Superdome]]
|73,208
|{{dts|1967}}
|[[Dennis Allen (American football)|Dennis Allen]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Tampa Bay Buccaneers]]'''
|[[Tampa, Florida|Tampa, FL]]
|[[Raymond James Stadium]]
|65,618
|{{dts|1976}}
|[[Todd Bowles]]
|-
! rowspan="4"|[[NFC West|West]]
|scope="row"|'''[[Arizona Cardinals]]'''*†
|[[Glendale, Arizona|Glendale, AZ]]
|[[State Farm Stadium]]
|63,400
|{{dts|1920}}
|[[Jonathan Gannon]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Los Angeles Rams]]'''*
|[[Inglewood, California|Inglewood, CA]]
|[[SoFi Stadium]]{{refn|The [[Los Angeles Chargers]] and [[Los Angeles Rams]] share [[SoFi Stadium]].<ref>{{cite web|last=Wharton|first=David|title=SoFi Stadium rises to a new level as Inglewood prepares for its impact|url=https://www.latimes.com/sports/story/2020-01-22/sofi-stadium-gentrification-inglewood-rams-chargers-nfl|website=Los Angeles Times|date=January 22, 2020|access-date=January 24, 2020}}</ref>|group=upper-alpha|name=f}}
|70,240
|{{dts|1936}} ([[American Football League (1936)|AFL]])<br>{{dts|1937}} (NFL)
|[[Sean McVay]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[San Francisco 49ers]]'''
|[[Santa Clara, California|Santa Clara, CA]]
|[[Levi's Stadium]]
|68,500
|{{dts|1946}} ([[All-America Football Conference|AAFC]])<br>{{dts|1950}} (NFL)
|[[Kyle Shanahan]]
|-
|scope="row"|'''[[Seattle Seahawks]]'''
|[[Seattle|Seattle, WA]]
|[[Lumen Field]]
|69,000
|{{dts|1976}}
|[[Pete Carroll]]
|-
|colspan="8" style="font-size:90%"|* Club has relocated at some point in its existence<br />† Club was a founding member of the NFL
|}

{{tref}}

== Semi-protected edit request on 20 January 2024 ==

{{Edit semi-protected|National Football League|answered=yes}}
I want to say that the AFL was started by Lamar Hunt. Change Bill Belichick to Jerod Mayo.[[User:Ufhsid|Ufhsid]] ([[User talk:Ufhsid|talk]]) 17:09, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
:[[File:Red question icon with gradient background.svg|20px|link=|alt=]] '''Not done:''' it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a [[WP:EDITXY|"change X to Y" format]] and provide a [[Wikipedia:Reliable sources|reliable source]] if appropriate.<!-- Template:ESp --> [[User:Shadow311|Shadow311]] ([[User talk:Shadow311|talk]]) 16:06, 23 January 2024 (UTC)

== Semi-protected edit request on 30 January 2024 ==

{{edit semi-protected|National Football League|answered=yes}}
Add a * next to the Ravens because they relocated from Cleveland. [[Special:Contributions/100.18.7.102|100.18.7.102]] ([[User talk:100.18.7.102|talk]]) 06:23, 30 January 2024 (UTC)

[[File:Red information icon with gradient background.svg|20px|link=|alt=]] '''Not done:'''<!-- Template:ESp --> Per the note on the page, the Ravens were considered a new franchise, and the Browns were considered to be inactive from 1996 to 1998. [[User:PianoDan|PianoDan]] ([[User talk:PianoDan|talk]]) 19:11, 30 January 2024 (UTC)

==Wiki Education assignment: University Writing 1020 Communicating Feminism MW 1 pm==
{{dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment | course = Wikipedia:Wiki_Ed/The_George_Washington_University/University_Writing_1020_Communicating_Feminism_MW_1_pm_(Spring_2024) | assignments = [[User:Alyssalauri|Alyssalauri]] | start_date = 2024-01-15 | end_date = 2024-05-15 }}

<span class="wikied-assignment" style="font-size:85%;">— Assignment last updated by [[User:Calliehoffman|Calliehoffman]] ([[User talk:Calliehoffman|talk]]) 19:52, 20 February 2024 (UTC)</span>


== Highest Level Source? ==
== Highest Level Source? ==
Line 371: Line 66:
== Requested move 3 March 2024 ==
== Requested move 3 March 2024 ==


<div class="boilerplate mw-archivedtalk" style="background-color: #efe; margin: 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px dotted #aaa;"><!-- Template:RM top -->
{{requested move/dated|multiple=yes
:''The following is a closed discussion of a [[Wikipedia:Requested moves|requested move]]. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a [[Wikipedia:move review|move review]] after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.''
|current1=National Football League|new1=NFL|current2=List of National Football League awards|new2=List of NFL awards|current3=List of cable television National Football League over-the-air affiliates|new3=List of cable television NFL over-the-air affiliates|current4=List of defunct National Football League franchises|new4=List of defunct NFL franchises|current5=National Football League franchise moves and mergers|new5=NFL franchise moves and mergers|current6=List of National Football League games played outside the United States|new6=List of NFL games played outside the United States|current7=List of National Football League head coaches|new7=List of NFL head coaches|current8=List of 500-yard passing games in the National Football League|new8=List of 500-yard passing games in the NFL|current9=List of current National Football League defensive coordinators|new9=List of current NFL defensive coordinators|current10=List of largest National Football League trades|new10=List of largest NFL trades|current11=List of most consecutive games with touchdown passes in the National Football League|new11=List of most consecutive games with touchdown passes in the NFL|current12=List of National Football League longest winning streaks|new12=List of NFL longest winning streaks|current13=List of National Football League players who spent their entire career with one franchise|new13=List of NFL players who spent their entire career with one franchise|current14=List of National Football League mascots|new14=List of NFL mascots|current15=List of National Football League longest losing streaks|new15=List of NFL longest losing streaks|current16=List of National Football League records (individual)|new16=List of NFL individual records|current17=List of National Football League records (team)|new17=List of NFL team records|current18=List of current National Football League offensive coordinators|new18=List of NFL offensive coordinators|current19=List of National Football League officials|new19=List of NFL officials|current20=National Football League records|new20=NFL records|current21=National Football League rivalries|new21=NFL rivalries|current22=List of National Football League seasons|new22=List of NFL seasons|current23=Lists of National Football League team seasons|new23=Lists of NFL team seasons|current24=Timeline of the National Football League|new24=Timeline of the NFL|}}

The result of the move request was: '''All articles except main article and timeline article moved..''' Upon review, there is general support for almost all of these moves, many contingent on not moving the main article, and some contingent on not moving the timeline article. Therefore, I believe sufficient consensus has been established based on the discussion below for the movement of all articles as proposed except for the main [[National Football League]] article, and the [[Timeline of the National Football League]] article. <small>([[Wikipedia:Requested moves/Closing instructions#Closure by a page mover|closed by non-admin page mover]])</small> [[User:EggRoll97|EggRoll97]] <sup>([[User_talk:EggRoll97|talk]]) </sup> 23:59, 20 March 2024 (UTC)
----


* [[:National Football League]] → {{no redirect|NFL}}
* [[:National Football League]] → {{no redirect|NFL}}
Line 398: Line 96:
* [[:Lists of National Football League team seasons]] → {{no redirect|Lists of NFL team seasons}}
* [[:Lists of National Football League team seasons]] → {{no redirect|Lists of NFL team seasons}}
* [[:Timeline of the National Football League]] → {{no redirect|Timeline of the NFL}}
* [[:Timeline of the National Football League]] → {{no redirect|Timeline of the NFL}}
– In response to the [[Talk:National Basketball Association#Requested move 28 February 2024|ongoing move discussion on the NBA page]], I request this set of page moves in order to meet [[WP:COMMONNAME]] and [[WP:CONCISE]]. '''[[User:ScarletViolet|<span style="color:#e82102;">Scarlet</span><span style="color:#6500a8;">Violet</span>]]''' ([[User talk:ScarletViolet|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/ScarletViolet|contribs]]) 12:39, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
– In response to the [[Talk:National Basketball Association#Requested move 28 February 2024|ongoing move discussion on the NBA page]], I request this set of page moves in order to meet [[WP:COMMONNAME]] and [[WP:CONCISE]]. '''[[User:ScarletViolet|<span style="color:#e82102;">Scarlet</span><span style="color:#6500a8;">Violet</span>]]''' ([[User talk:ScarletViolet|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/ScarletViolet|contribs]]) 12:39, 3 March 2024 (UTC) <small>—&nbsp;'''''Relisting.'''''&nbsp;'''[[User:JML1148|JML1148]]''' <sup>([[User talk:JML1148|<span style="color:#58c8cc">talk</span>]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/JML1148|<span style="color:#58c8cc">contribs</span>]])</sup> 10:10, 13 March 2024 (UTC)</small>


:'''Oppose league article, fine with the others''' in line with the discussion at [[Talk:National Basketball Association]] [[User:Oknazevad|oknazevad]] ([[User talk:Oknazevad|talk]]) 13:19, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
:'''Oppose league article, fine with the others''' in line with the discussion at [[Talk:National Basketball Association]] [[User:Oknazevad|oknazevad]] ([[User talk:Oknazevad|talk]]) 13:19, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
:'''Oppose all''' – The NFL is not only called the NFL and it's not beneficial to move it to the short form acronym. Then, for consistency, it doesn't make sense to use the acronym for the rest of the pages. [[User:Hey man im josh|Hey man im josh]] ([[User talk:Hey man im josh|talk]]) 13:32, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
:'''Oppose all''' – The NFL is not only called the NFL and it's not beneficial to move it to the short form acronym. Then, for consistency, it doesn't make sense to use the acronym for the rest of the pages. [[User:Hey man im josh|Hey man im josh]] ([[User talk:Hey man im josh|talk]]) 13:32, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
::The status quo actually isn't consistent. For example, there's the existing season pages (e.g. [[2023 NFL season]]) and the drafts ([[2023 NFL draft]]), among others. —[[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]] ([[User talk:Bagumba|talk]]) 14:46, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
::The status quo actually isn't consistent. For example, there's the existing season pages (e.g. [[2023 NFL season]]) and the drafts ([[2023 NFL draft]]), among others. —[[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]] ([[User talk:Bagumba|talk]]) 14:46, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
:::{{U|Hey man im josh}}, thoughts on {{U|Bagumba}}'s comment above, the discussion below and the close at [[NBA]]? Possibility of reconsidering?<span style="white-space:nowrap; font-family:Harlow Solid Italic;">[[User:Gonzo_fan2007|<span style="font-size:small; color:teal;"> « Gonzo fan2007</span>]] [[User talk:Gonzo_fan2007#top|<small style="color:#2A2722">(talk)</small>]] @ </span> 21:52, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
:<small>Note: [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Football League|WikiProject National Football League]] has been notified of this discussion. [[User:Vanderwaalforces|Vanderwaalforces]] ([[User talk:Vanderwaalforces|talk]]) 13:49, 3 March 2024 (UTC)</small>
:<small>Note: [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Football League|WikiProject National Football League]] has been notified of this discussion. [[User:Vanderwaalforces|Vanderwaalforces]] ([[User talk:Vanderwaalforces|talk]]) 13:49, 3 March 2024 (UTC)</small>
:<small>Note: [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject American Football League|WikiProject American Football League]] has been notified of this discussion. [[User:Vanderwaalforces|Vanderwaalforces]] ([[User talk:Vanderwaalforces|talk]]) 13:49, 3 March 2024 (UTC)</small>
:<small>Note: [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject American Football League|WikiProject American Football League]] has been notified of this discussion. [[User:Vanderwaalforces|Vanderwaalforces]] ([[User talk:Vanderwaalforces|talk]]) 13:49, 3 March 2024 (UTC)</small>
Line 412: Line 111:
*'''Oppose changing the main article as well as 'Timeline of the National Football League'''' and '''Support''' the rest per the above comments as well as reasoning at the NBA requested move. The timeline is a historical record of the league and its development and ongoing heritage, so the full name seems historically significant there. [[User:Randy Kryn|Randy Kryn]] ([[User talk:Randy Kryn|talk]]) 15:36, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Oppose changing the main article as well as 'Timeline of the National Football League'''' and '''Support''' the rest per the above comments as well as reasoning at the NBA requested move. The timeline is a historical record of the league and its development and ongoing heritage, so the full name seems historically significant there. [[User:Randy Kryn|Randy Kryn]] ([[User talk:Randy Kryn|talk]]) 15:36, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' National Football League → NFL. [[User:Srnec|Srnec]] ([[User talk:Srnec|talk]]) 16:27, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' National Football League → NFL. [[User:Srnec|Srnec]] ([[User talk:Srnec|talk]]) 16:27, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
**{{U|Srnec}}, do you mind clarifying, do you just oppose [[NFL]], but support the other proposed moves?<span style="white-space:nowrap; font-family:Harlow Solid Italic;">[[User:Gonzo_fan2007|<span style="font-size:small; color:teal;"> « Gonzo fan2007</span>]] [[User talk:Gonzo_fan2007#top|<small style="color:#2A2722">(talk)</small>]] @ </span> 21:55, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
***I oppose the first move. I do not have an opinion on the others. [[User:Srnec|Srnec]] ([[User talk:Srnec|talk]]) 22:08, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Support all but [[NFL]]''' (and neutral on the timeline) for the sake of concision. [[User:Hameltion|Hameltion]] ([[User talk:Hameltion|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Hameltion|contribs]]) 18:55, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Support all but [[NFL]]''' (and neutral on the timeline) for the sake of concision. [[User:Hameltion|Hameltion]] ([[User talk:Hameltion|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Hameltion|contribs]]) 18:55, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' main article per [https://www.britannica.com/topic/National-Football-League Britannica], unsure on others. '''[[User:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Green">Crouch, Swale</span>]]''' ([[User talk:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Blue">talk</span>]]) 22:26, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' main article per [https://www.britannica.com/topic/National-Football-League Britannica], unsure on others. '''[[User:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Green">Crouch, Swale</span>]]''' ([[User talk:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Blue">talk</span>]]) 22:26, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
Line 434: Line 135:
*'''Comment''' FWIW, the similar move request at {{section link|Talk:National_Basketball_Association#Requested_move_28_February_2024}} has been closed, moving all pages to its concise "NBA" counterpart, except for the base page [[National Basketball Association]].—[[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]] ([[User talk:Bagumba|talk]]) 15:54, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' FWIW, the similar move request at {{section link|Talk:National_Basketball_Association#Requested_move_28_February_2024}} has been closed, moving all pages to its concise "NBA" counterpart, except for the base page [[National Basketball Association]].—[[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]] ([[User talk:Bagumba|talk]]) 15:54, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
*:Ok@[[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]] [[User:PlaneCrashKing1264|PlaneCrashKing1264]] ([[User talk:PlaneCrashKing1264|talk]]) 16:52, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
*:Ok@[[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]] [[User:PlaneCrashKing1264|PlaneCrashKing1264]] ([[User talk:PlaneCrashKing1264|talk]]) 16:52, 6 March 2024 (UTC)

:'''Oppose''', for the main article, '''Support''', for the other subpages, per [[User:oknazevad|oknazevad]] and [[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]]. [[User:JParksT2023|JParksT2023]] ([[User talk:JParksT2023|talk]]) 15:59, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
{{cot|NBA-specific technical issues}}
*::@[[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]] FYI, I can't move [[List of National Basketball Association general managers]] to shortened version for some reason. - [[User:BeFriendlyGoodSir|BeFriendlyGoodSir]] ([[User talk:BeFriendlyGoodSir|talk]]) 18:12, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
*::@[[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]] FYI, I can't move [[List of National Basketball Association general managers]] to shortened version for some reason. - [[User:BeFriendlyGoodSir|BeFriendlyGoodSir]] ([[User talk:BeFriendlyGoodSir|talk]]) 18:12, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
*:::@[[User:BeFriendlyGoodSir|BeFriendlyGoodSir]]-- Me neither. [[User:PlaneCrashKing1264|PlaneCrashKing1264]] ([[User talk:PlaneCrashKing1264|talk]]) 21:24, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
*:::@[[User:BeFriendlyGoodSir|BeFriendlyGoodSir]]-- Me neither. [[User:PlaneCrashKing1264|PlaneCrashKing1264]] ([[User talk:PlaneCrashKing1264|talk]]) 21:24, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
Line 440: Line 144:
*::::::Not again! [[User:PlaneCrashKing1264|PlaneCrashKing1264]] ([[User talk:PlaneCrashKing1264|talk]]) 23:01, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
*::::::Not again! [[User:PlaneCrashKing1264|PlaneCrashKing1264]] ([[User talk:PlaneCrashKing1264|talk]]) 23:01, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
*:::::::If you're thinking that would result in another week-long discussion, that's not the case. It was moved in response to my request (see [[Talk:List of National Basketball Association general managers]]). —⁠ ⁠[[User:BarrelProof|BarrelProof]] ([[User talk:BarrelProof|talk]]) 23:09, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
*:::::::If you're thinking that would result in another week-long discussion, that's not the case. It was moved in response to my request (see [[Talk:List of National Basketball Association general managers]]). —⁠ ⁠[[User:BarrelProof|BarrelProof]] ([[User talk:BarrelProof|talk]]) 23:09, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
{{cob}}
* '''Support''' renaming except for the league article itself and [[Timeline of the National Football League]]. The name "NFL" is globally ubiquitous, like "FIFA", and the most logical search terms. Redirects will be maintained for the 0.5% of users typing in the full name of the league as a search term. [[User:Carrite|Carrite]] ([[User talk:Carrite|talk]]) 17:02, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Support''' renaming except [[National Football League]] per the reasoning and consensus established for professional basketball at [[Talk:National Basketball Association]].<span style="white-space:nowrap; font-family:Harlow Solid Italic;">[[User:Gonzo_fan2007|<span style="font-size:small; color:teal;"> « Gonzo fan2007</span>]] [[User talk:Gonzo_fan2007#top|<small style="color:#2A2722">(talk)</small>]] @ </span> 21:40, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
**'''Comment''' there are probably a lot of downstream resulting tecnical moves, like to categories and templates, if this passes. I.e. {{cl|Lists of Pro Bowl selections by National Football League team}} -> {{cl|Lists of Pro Bowl selections by NFL team}}.<span style="white-space:nowrap; font-family:Harlow Solid Italic;">[[User:Gonzo_fan2007|<span style="font-size:small; color:teal;"> « Gonzo fan2007</span>]] [[User talk:Gonzo_fan2007#top|<small style="color:#2A2722">(talk)</small>]] @ </span> 14:34, 13 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Support''' all except for National Football League. Regarding the added ambiguity, I believe that NFL is a sufficiently-common acronym to be generally understood. Any added ambiguity is, in my opinion, worth the shorter article names. [[User:Useight|Useight]] ([[User talk:Useight|talk]]) 23:21, 13 March 2024 (UTC)
*'''Support''' per [[WP:SHORTFORM]], which notes that we use [[Central Intelligence Agency]], but [[CIA activities in Vietnam]] and [[List of CIA station chiefs]], and [[Federal Bureau of Investigation]], but [[FBI files on Elvis Presley]] and [[FBI Ten Most Wanted Fugitives]]. [[User:BD2412|<span style="background:gold">'''''BD2412'''''</span>]] [[User talk:BD2412|'''T''']] 02:15, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
* '''Comment''' I think consensus has been reached here. Should this be closed soon? Majority seems to support shortened form (NFL) for all except main article and Timeline article. - [[User:BeFriendlyGoodSir|BeFriendlyGoodSir]] ([[User talk:BeFriendlyGoodSir|talk]]) 06:07, 20 March 2024 (UTC)
*:It was relisted on the 13th (arguably, there was even consensus then, as the "opposes" were mostly just regarding a single page—the main [[National Football League]] page), so it is scheduled to be reviewed again soon.—[[User:Bagumba|Bagumba]] ([[User talk:Bagumba|talk]]) 06:16, 20 March 2024 (UTC)



<div style="padding-left: 1.6em; font-style: italic; border-top: 1px solid #a2a9b1; margin: 0.5em 0; padding-top: 0.5em">The discussion above is closed. <b style="color: #FF0000;">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.</div><!-- from [[Template:Archive bottom]] -->
</div><div style="clear:both;" class=></div>
== What's your opinion? ==
== What's your opinion? ==


Line 453: Line 168:
:::::It's not got too much detail, it's a good amount to summarise the main points of how teams, conferences and TV blackouts work, which are all key concepts to understanding the NFL (particularly for readers that don't watch much NFL). [[User:Joseph2302|<b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b>]][[User talk:Joseph2302|<b style="color:#000000">2302</b>]] ([[User talk:Joseph2302|talk]]) 15:06, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
:::::It's not got too much detail, it's a good amount to summarise the main points of how teams, conferences and TV blackouts work, which are all key concepts to understanding the NFL (particularly for readers that don't watch much NFL). [[User:Joseph2302|<b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b>]][[User talk:Joseph2302|<b style="color:#000000">2302</b>]] ([[User talk:Joseph2302|talk]]) 15:06, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
::::::Ok, just asking [[User:PlaneCrashKing1264|PlaneCrashKing1264]] ([[User talk:PlaneCrashKing1264|talk]]) 17:15, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
::::::Ok, just asking [[User:PlaneCrashKing1264|PlaneCrashKing1264]] ([[User talk:PlaneCrashKing1264|talk]]) 17:15, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

== Semi-protected edit request on 17 April 2024 ==

{{Edit semi-protected|National Football League|answered=yes}}
Can someone please update the regular season section of the season format section of this page to include the 2023–24 NFL standings? Please. [[Special:Contributions/2601:40A:8400:1820:75F2:A114:503F:13FC|2601:40A:8400:1820:75F2:A114:503F:13FC]] ([[User talk:2601:40A:8400:1820:75F2:A114:503F:13FC|talk]]) 22:04, 17 April 2024 (UTC)
:[[File:Red question icon with gradient background.svg|20px|link=|alt=]] '''Not done:''' it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a [[WP:EDITXY|"change X to Y" format]] and provide a [[Wikipedia:Reliable sources|reliable source]] if appropriate.<!-- Template:ESp --> [[User:GrayStorm|GrayStorm]]<sup>([[User_talk:GrayStorm|Talk]]&#124;[[Special:Contributions/GrayStorm|Contributions]])</sup> 23:27, 17 April 2024 (UTC)
::The standings are stuck in 2021-22, which had already passed. That's why it needs to be updated. [[Special:Contributions/2601:40A:8400:1820:75F2:A114:503F:13FC|2601:40A:8400:1820:75F2:A114:503F:13FC]] ([[User talk:2601:40A:8400:1820:75F2:A114:503F:13FC|talk]]) 23:35, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

== Change the term club back to team ==

The is American football this is not soccer we did not use the term club. Every fan and every player also every owner reference there club as team. [[Special:Contributions/2601:2C6:8400:DCF0:A6E7:21:B52A:912D|2601:2C6:8400:DCF0:A6E7:21:B52A:912D]] ([[User talk:2601:2C6:8400:DCF0:A6E7:21:B52A:912D|talk]]) 07:44, 25 April 2024 (UTC)

:I agree with this and have made the change, although another person then reverted it on the theory that the NFL uses "clubs." As anyone who edits Wikipedia knows, the league's usage is not controlling—the rule is to use the terminology most seen in common usage. I don’t see how anyone can seriously dispute that in American English the normal term is "teams," except perhaps among some soccer fans who persist in using other odd terminology like "kit" when they mean "uniform" and "match" when they mean "game." [[User:1995hoo|1995hoo]] ([[User talk:1995hoo|talk]]) 01:02, 15 May 2024 (UTC)
::This has been "Club" for over a decade now, as a good article. The proper term is "Club". The league always uses this term when referring to the organizations. We need to be accurate when referring to things - it's not a matter of [[WP:COMMONNAME]], it's a matter of basic accuracy. "Club", "franchise", "team" - all of these have meanings. Using them incorrectly can confuse, but more importantly, it's simply not accurate. "Club" is the organization itself, "franchise" is the slot in the league, and "team" is the actual team out on the field; see, for example, the [https://www.panthers.com/team/players-roster/ Carolina Panthers] website, where "Team" links to the roster listing. See, as an example, this recent [https://nflpa.com/nfl-player-team-report-cards-2024 NFLPA report], which uses "club" to refer to the organization and "team" to refer to the team on the field. Team and club are not the same thing. That being said - the article, as it is right now, is inconsistent in usage, and this should be corrected. '''[[User:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Toa</i>]] [[User talk:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Nidhiki05</i>]]''' 01:54, 15 May 2024 (UTC)
:::It’s 10:00 at night, so I’m not going to think about it further tonight. But I believe your analysis, while "technically" accurate as a matter of word definitions, is unnecessarily hypertechnical because there is no doubt that the commonly used, and widely understood, term is "teams." No reader will be remotely confused by the use of "teams," which is also consistent with the usage in all the other North American major leagues' articles (even MLS, where I’d expect people to be militant about using British terminology). I ''sincerely'' doubt this word is even remotely relevant to good article status. [[User:1995hoo|1995hoo]] ([[User talk:1995hoo|talk]]) 02:06, 15 May 2024 (UTC)
::::It's not British terminology. It's the terminology the league uses, and has always used. There are exceptions - we don't call the "extra point" the "try", for example - but it's not like "club" is unknown. '''[[User:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Toa</i>]] [[User talk:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Nidhiki05</i>]]''' 02:16, 15 May 2024 (UTC)
::::The NBA, NHL, MLB, and MLS pages all have a section titled Teams, not Clubs. So, using the definition that teams only refers to the actual players on the field, then shouldn't the other pages be updated too? After all, why should the NFL page be unique in this sense? [[User:Alielmi1207|Alielmi1207]] ([[User talk:Alielmi1207|talk]]) 17:16, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
*I agree with using "teams" as the common term. Overly technical pedantry is irrelevant in what word to use in the header, as it'll both are completely accurate. That is to say, even if we conceded a distinction between the organization and the playing squad, the material in the chart is applicable to both. Consistency with other major North American sports leagues should be maintained (yes, even the CFL uses "teams"). The fact that this gets changed periodically and is changed back by one editor tells me that there's some [[WP:OWN]] going on here. [[User:Oknazevad|oknazevad]] ([[User talk:Oknazevad|talk]]) 17:43, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
*:It's not an accurate term. A handful of Wikipedia editors who genuinely do not know what they are talking about doesn't make a commonname. '''[[User:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Toa</i>]] [[User talk:Toa Nidhiki05|<i style="color: green; font-family: Mistral;">Nidhiki05</i>]]''' 22:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)

== NFL Sunday Ticket lawsuit ==

Should NFL Sunday Ticket lawsuit be mentioned here? It's mentioned on [[NFL Sunday Ticket]] but given that NFL could potentially have to pay $4B, seems significant enough to mention here. https://frontofficesports.com/nfl-sunday-ticket-trial-jury-ruling/ [[User:Sawitontwitter|Sawitontwitter]] ([[User talk:Sawitontwitter|talk]]) 12:59, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

Revision as of 09:58, 10 July 2024

Good articleNational Football League has been listed as one of the Sports and recreation good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
On this day... Article milestones
DateProcessResult
October 23, 2005Good article nomineeListed
March 4, 2006Good article reassessmentDelisted
January 3, 2009Good article nomineeNot listed
June 27, 2013Good article nomineeListed
On this day... Facts from this article were featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the "On this day..." column on August 20, 2019, August 20, 2020, and August 20, 2023.
Current status: Good article


Highest Level Source?

In the first paragraph there is an opinion, being "the highest professional level of American football in the world.". This is clearly just someone's opinion and due to the competition not being open to any other countries, I don't see how this claim can be made. John arneVN (talk) 02:29, 24 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There's nothing stopping another country to pick up American football and organize a high-level professional league. Its just that no body has done it. So by reduction, the NFL is the highest professional level of American football in the world. Removing the "in the world" part would imply that there was another league higher or same level as NFL and that is simply not true. JackFromWisconsin (talk | contribs) 16:20, 25 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Heck, it's the only fully professional American football league in the world, save the newly merged UFL, which is by its own admission a lower tier. This is approaching WP:BLUE territory. oknazevad (talk) 16:46, 25 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There's also a source already in the lead backing the claim up. Toa Nidhiki05 01:58, 26 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 3 March 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: All articles except main article and timeline article moved.. Upon review, there is general support for almost all of these moves, many contingent on not moving the main article, and some contingent on not moving the timeline article. Therefore, I believe sufficient consensus has been established based on the discussion below for the movement of all articles as proposed except for the main National Football League article, and the Timeline of the National Football League article. (closed by non-admin page mover) EggRoll97 (talk) 23:59, 20 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

– In response to the ongoing move discussion on the NBA page, I request this set of page moves in order to meet WP:COMMONNAME and WP:CONCISE. ScarletViolet (talk • contribs) 12:39, 3 March 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. JML1148 (talk | contribs) 10:10, 13 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose league article, fine with the others in line with the discussion at Talk:National Basketball Association oknazevad (talk) 13:19, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose all – The NFL is not only called the NFL and it's not beneficial to move it to the short form acronym. Then, for consistency, it doesn't make sense to use the acronym for the rest of the pages. Hey man im josh (talk) 13:32, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The status quo actually isn't consistent. For example, there's the existing season pages (e.g. 2023 NFL season) and the drafts (2023 NFL draft), among others. —Bagumba (talk) 14:46, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hey man im josh, thoughts on Bagumba's comment above, the discussion below and the close at NBA? Possibility of reconsidering? « Gonzo fan2007 (talk) @ 21:52, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: WikiProject National Football League has been notified of this discussion. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 13:49, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: WikiProject American Football League has been notified of this discussion. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 13:49, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: WikiProject American football has been notified of this discussion. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 13:50, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
—⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 06:06, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose, for the main article, Support, for the other subpages, per oknazevad and Bagumba. JParksT2023 (talk) 15:59, 14 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
NBA-specific technical issues


The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

What's your opinion?

So, should we split the NFL teams section into it's own article? PlaneCrashKing1264 (talk) 16:58, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Try requesting a move, see how that works. 75.176.73.120 (talk) 02:31, 5 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't know how to, though. PlaneCrashKing1264 (talk) 02:43, 5 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Is this referring to the section National Football League § Clubs?—Bagumba (talk) 05:09, 5 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah. PlaneCrashKing1264 (talk) 13:51, 5 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's not particularly large. What would be added? Consider the guideline WP:AVOIDSPLIT:

...editors are encouraged to work on further developing the parent article first, locating coverage that applies to both the main topic and the subtopic. Through this process, it may become evident that subtopics or groups of subtopics can demonstrate their own notability, and thus can be split off into their own article.

—Bagumba (talk) 14:40, 5 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's useful for this page and doesn't need a split. Remember that for every split a large percentage of readers are lost, so best to keep everything in this article presentable and in one place. Randy Kryn (talk) 14:46, 5 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's not got too much detail, it's a good amount to summarise the main points of how teams, conferences and TV blackouts work, which are all key concepts to understanding the NFL (particularly for readers that don't watch much NFL). Joseph2302 (talk) 15:06, 5 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, just asking PlaneCrashKing1264 (talk) 17:15, 5 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 17 April 2024

Can someone please update the regular season section of the season format section of this page to include the 2023–24 NFL standings? Please. 2601:40A:8400:1820:75F2:A114:503F:13FC (talk) 22:04, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. GrayStorm(Talk|Contributions) 23:27, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The standings are stuck in 2021-22, which had already passed. That's why it needs to be updated. 2601:40A:8400:1820:75F2:A114:503F:13FC (talk) 23:35, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Change the term club back to team

The is American football this is not soccer we did not use the term club. Every fan and every player also every owner reference there club as team. 2601:2C6:8400:DCF0:A6E7:21:B52A:912D (talk) 07:44, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with this and have made the change, although another person then reverted it on the theory that the NFL uses "clubs." As anyone who edits Wikipedia knows, the league's usage is not controlling—the rule is to use the terminology most seen in common usage. I don’t see how anyone can seriously dispute that in American English the normal term is "teams," except perhaps among some soccer fans who persist in using other odd terminology like "kit" when they mean "uniform" and "match" when they mean "game." 1995hoo (talk) 01:02, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This has been "Club" for over a decade now, as a good article. The proper term is "Club". The league always uses this term when referring to the organizations. We need to be accurate when referring to things - it's not a matter of WP:COMMONNAME, it's a matter of basic accuracy. "Club", "franchise", "team" - all of these have meanings. Using them incorrectly can confuse, but more importantly, it's simply not accurate. "Club" is the organization itself, "franchise" is the slot in the league, and "team" is the actual team out on the field; see, for example, the Carolina Panthers website, where "Team" links to the roster listing. See, as an example, this recent NFLPA report, which uses "club" to refer to the organization and "team" to refer to the team on the field. Team and club are not the same thing. That being said - the article, as it is right now, is inconsistent in usage, and this should be corrected. Toa Nidhiki05 01:54, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It’s 10:00 at night, so I’m not going to think about it further tonight. But I believe your analysis, while "technically" accurate as a matter of word definitions, is unnecessarily hypertechnical because there is no doubt that the commonly used, and widely understood, term is "teams." No reader will be remotely confused by the use of "teams," which is also consistent with the usage in all the other North American major leagues' articles (even MLS, where I’d expect people to be militant about using British terminology). I sincerely doubt this word is even remotely relevant to good article status. 1995hoo (talk) 02:06, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's not British terminology. It's the terminology the league uses, and has always used. There are exceptions - we don't call the "extra point" the "try", for example - but it's not like "club" is unknown. Toa Nidhiki05 02:16, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The NBA, NHL, MLB, and MLS pages all have a section titled Teams, not Clubs. So, using the definition that teams only refers to the actual players on the field, then shouldn't the other pages be updated too? After all, why should the NFL page be unique in this sense? Alielmi1207 (talk) 17:16, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • I agree with using "teams" as the common term. Overly technical pedantry is irrelevant in what word to use in the header, as it'll both are completely accurate. That is to say, even if we conceded a distinction between the organization and the playing squad, the material in the chart is applicable to both. Consistency with other major North American sports leagues should be maintained (yes, even the CFL uses "teams"). The fact that this gets changed periodically and is changed back by one editor tells me that there's some WP:OWN going on here. oknazevad (talk) 17:43, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    It's not an accurate term. A handful of Wikipedia editors who genuinely do not know what they are talking about doesn't make a commonname. Toa Nidhiki05 22:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

NFL Sunday Ticket lawsuit

Should NFL Sunday Ticket lawsuit be mentioned here? It's mentioned on NFL Sunday Ticket but given that NFL could potentially have to pay $4B, seems significant enough to mention here. https://frontofficesports.com/nfl-sunday-ticket-trial-jury-ruling/ Sawitontwitter (talk) 12:59, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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