April 22, 2024 • 32 mins
From their party days to bonding over bad boyfriends, Shannen and Tori felt like sisters.
So what tore this inseparable pair apart?
Who REALLY came between the colleagues turned confidants?
What happened on the set of 90210 that caused a divide neither of them wanted?
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
This is Let's Be Clear with Shannon Doherty. Hi, everyone,
welcome to another episode of Let's Be Clear with Shannon Doherty.
You guys, be prepared, Be prepared. This is wild. Uh
Tori spelling?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Hi? Oh my god, I've never heard you say my
full name.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
I know.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
That was so weird. No, it's usually tour. Yeah, I
got you out of bed, very happy about that.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Yeah, I want to I want to ask you because
I'm curious because I know that you're like very thoughtful
about how you present stuff and do things. You don't
just do things randomly in your professional personal life, maybe
a little random, questionable, much like me. So, why did
you choose to do your podcast from your bed?
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Oh? So, here's not the thought out answer. It just happened.
The first one we did, the first episod so at
the Beverly Hills Hotel and the bed was the only option.
But then I liked it. It felt intimate. Yah, I
like it. Okay, so I'm gonna continue. But yeah, so
(01:12):
for you.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Being in the bed, it probably makes you because it
feels more intimate, probably makes you feel safer, like you
can be a safer but a little bit more raw
and vulnerable.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Correct. All right, So now now I approve of the bed.
I want I should at your dining room table at
the head of it. But at least you gave me
one I did well, you know.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
So you and I very recently flew back from Pittsburgh together.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
We did.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
My friend has a plane and he was gracious enough
because it was my birthday weekend to fly me there
and fly a couple of us back.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Because we talked a lot, I kind of was like, yeah,
here's all the points that we wanted to talk about,
So we're kind of gonna relive some of the plane.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
First of all, that plain experience was amazing. Yep, that
was so good. It's yeah, okay.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
So anyway, we were talking about our friends, probably some
of our listeners.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
We'll remember.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Lots of photos paparazzi photos of the two of us
out and about I mean, well, yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
We hit it very hard. Oh my gosh, Roxbury bar One. Wait,
can I take it back to the beginning. Yeah, please
do going out. Remember the rat party for the pilot
I believe it was at Spago, and you and I
(02:46):
went and got our hair done that day at the
salon that was at the Beverly Hills Hotel. I don't
remember that. We got our hair done and we went
and I think it was at Spago. I know it
was at Spago because there's more to this. We went
there and at the time, I was like Brian, Brian, Brian.
(03:07):
Wasn't there a time when I was like Brian, Brian Brian,
But anyway, and he was going to go with us,
and then he didn't end up and I was like spiraling,
like I thought he liked. We didn't eat as usual,
like we drank. I was underage, though, yes, so were you.
Yes we both were correct. Listen, that's what teenagers do.
(03:32):
You know, They sneak their parents sherry or like whatever
is around the house. I'm kids. I'm not saying that
you should be doing this obviously, but you know, especially
not sharing well. I mean, but we were starring on
a show. It was your show, basically you and Jason,
and we were there as filler at the moment. But
they didn't stop us from drinking alcohol at the cast party,
(03:55):
and they were all excited, and I don't think anyone
looked at anything anyway. I ended up not eating and
I was plumbing that, like, oh my god, Brian Austin
Green doesn't like me. What do I do? What do
I do? And I just remember we ended up in
the stall at Spago and you were holding my hair
and I was puking up their infamous pasta. That's how
I know it was Spago. Yeah, and you were just
(04:17):
like there were noodles just coming out and You're like,
oh my god. Yeah. So I guess I did eat
something but hadn't even. I just right and drank a
lot and then I had to get home, and I
feel like my parents wanted to ground me, but I
was like, I'm on a hit show, like it's just
like it just launched, and like this is cool and
(04:37):
like okay, but I'm really just a sixteen year old girl,
and now I'm being grounded because I puked.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Fair enough that you got grounded fair enough. And I
think I was seventeen and a half or just from
eighteen on the pilot, so I should have been grounded
as well.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
But even they tried to my dad probably was like, Babe, jam.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Maybe we weren't. I wasn't hanging out at the manor
as much yet yet. It was during season one and
season two that I think I stayed at the manor
equally as much as you stayed at my house. Correct,
And we would often walk into the manor. First off,
(05:21):
two things that always stood out to me about the
manor was a walking in and was it nan nanny
you made the food? She always left like cookies for
us in late the kitchen.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
Yeah, I remember this.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
She always loved food and she knew I was always
hungry super late at night, so she always left me.
She loved you, and I loved her too. She was
so special and took such good care of me whenever
I was there. She would like leave waters out for
us and just really try to make sure that we
were okay. So that's always very memorable to me. But
(05:55):
then one of the times we went on the elevator
to go upstairs, and do you remember the elevator doors
open on the second floor and your mother was standing
there staring at us in the elevator, and we we.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Started laughing so hard, like we could not. She always
waited up for us, but she was mad.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
She was mad we were later than normal and she
was not happy about it.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
And she was right.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
The thing was like, we needed to at least call
and let someone know that we were going to be
that late or take security or like something.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
But I was petrified. But you were a year and
a half older. That was your responsibility, right technically, but
I had also never been out. I love that You're
like we didn't call like she was like, it was
both of us, but it was That's how my parents
felt about Shan Like it was like literally, yeah, it
was their kids, it was both of us were supposed
(06:58):
to call it.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
We had a responsibility, and when neither one of us
did it, Candy would get upset. Yeah, fair enough that
she got upset. God, those were like wild times. And
(07:23):
those infamous photos of I said to Roxbury with Brian
and Marky Mark flipping off the photographers and then just
other ones of us walking out again laughing. I think
you and I for two seasons did a lot of
laughing until we didn't because of boyfriends. Fair a lot
(07:46):
of laughing, a lot of laughing for the soul. I mean,
we were best friends. We were sisters, correct, like hardcore sisters.
And I know your dad got really upset with me
about something and I told this story when Brian I think,
was on the podcast and and I came to your
(08:07):
house and security didn't really want to let me in
because your dad was super mad at me. But your
mom saw me. I guess I'm like cameras, so she
told him to let me in, and then she waited
for me, you know how like you pulled in guard
gate and then he pulled the left, and I pulled
to the right and parking right there, and the door
would go into like the hallway and then the kitchen right.
(08:28):
So your mom was standing there waiting for me again,
and she said, I don't care what is ever happening
between you and my husband. You're always welcome to my
home and hugs me and I she never said that
to me.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
She was the favorite child, so that's that's okay. You
were daddy's girl, fair, Yeah, you were daddy's girl. So
we were you know, listen, if you were late, I
was late. If I was like you were late, yep,
because we were always together and and we were definitely
late a few times. Yes, And some cast members didn't
(09:07):
really like that, which I understand as well, but I
always got the brunt of it you did because they're
not going to say something to the producer's daughter, correct,
And at the time that is something that I didn't
see right because I couldn't you know, I was in it.
It was hard to see. And I prided myself when
(09:27):
I started that show being on time because I was like,
everyone's going to hate me. I'm the producer's daughter. I
have to be on time. And then you know, we
all got comfortable and we got this big life suddenly
that exploded quickly. Yes, and we were young, Like when
you're that young, you don't have I don't think you
have the mental capacity to fully process what's happening in
(09:50):
a really healthy way. You can't. Possibly. We weren't developed.
We were teenagers my kids' ages, you know, And I
can't imagine the responsibility that we had giving to my kids,
my fifteen six year old right now, and like come
to Harold and I'm like, whoa, can we go back
(10:11):
to the Brian market mark picture real quick? So that picture,
like it was different back then. You guys like paparazzi
didn't follow you everywhere. They would be at like certain
places like nightclubs, restaurants, and they would say do you
mind taking a picture? They would ask you usually when
you came in or out, but that day they were
(10:32):
like ravenous because it was the four of us. We
were up in the VIP room. We thought it was
blacked out windows correct, and someone's like, oh, they're taking pictures.
Were like, oh, whatever, and we flipped them off all
four of us and the four of us at the
same time because we were like, they can't see this meanwhile,
full on picture like yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
And went everywhere, everywhere, absolutely everywhere. There's only one other
picture from nine oh to and oho that I remember
went everywhere was Jason and I making out at like
an after party for an award show, and that thing
went everywhere too, and I was like, oh, I'm making
out with my brother.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
This is not good. It was always hot when that happened.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
But yeah, so we had a ridiculous amount of fun
we did. And again like sisters, like best friends. And
then I remember you had We both got boyfriends that
ended up being friends and they weren't great, No, they
were not good. Both had a lot of issues. They
(11:34):
were better to each other than they were to us. Yeah,
so good thing. And I think what we were trying
to figure out on the plane is what was the
pivotal moment that because it's like one minute we were friends,
and then one minute we weren't. Yeah, And you know,
I think from my perspective as I was looking in now,
(11:56):
being an outsider, I saw that you were swayed by
two certain individuals, and particularly one and it.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
Was I'm swear huh you know I'm as swear. Yeah, yes,
my downfall. Yeah yeah, you were always easily swayed.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
And it was very frustrating for me because I always
used to tell you, like now tour have an opinion,
like you're smart, you're funny, you're talented. I loved you
and I respected you, and I wanted you to believe
in yourself as much as I believed in you. So
then seeing you like get swayed and our friendship ending.
But we on the plane, we're trying to figure out
(12:35):
what was the weak point where you were able to
be swayed, and and I kind of just went, I can't,
I can't keep fighting for this. And I think it
was your boyfriend. Really, I do I think he was
because he was he was abusive, abusive, and I, yeah,
like very believed physically. I remember we went to Mexico
(12:58):
with our boyfriends pictures, and I mean Mexico. You know
you called me crying, like from your room, and you
came to my room, and there was a point I
specifically remember looking at you and saying, you have to
end it with him or I'm going to actually kill him,
Like I can't, I can't stand by and watch this.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
So I could be in jail.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
And all I can think is that because you you
didn't break out with him, you you stayed and you
got tortured for a little bit longer. But did I wait,
I'm trying to but we sort of started drifting apart.
I don't know if that was it. I don't know
if you know, you started listening to those other people.
(13:47):
I don't know if it was. There were so many
really interesting moments about like that time in the show
and in our relationship, because there was this whole conversation
about what to buy the crew for Christmas as a cast,
and somebody, one of the cast members, suggested a van
that we would then donate to charity, like we were used
(14:09):
a van and we would all, you know, donate like
fifteen hundred dollars for the van and then donate it
to charity in the name of the crew. And I
was like, I'll just donate money directly to a charity.
But I'm not I'm not doing this to my crew, Like, yeah,
what does that get them?
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Gets them?
Speaker 1 (14:26):
You know, they want a party, they want T shirts,
they want hats, they want you know, a DVD player
if there were DVDs back then. Maybe they were laser
disc I don't know, but like or vhs things Walkman
Walkman's But and I remember we ended up still doing
a party and the crew was so thankful that they
got to like just hang out and let loose and
(14:47):
have free drinks and free food and a DJ and
like party and have fun. But I know that that
caused a huge rift between me and three of the
cast members.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Let's all coming back, is it okay? So tell me
what's coming back to you. I don't know. I remember
that particular moment that I was really conflicted because I
had everyone coming at me like to be on this
side or that side? Is like why? And it was
one against many and I was young and young you
(15:34):
know what? Fuck that? Sorry, I got easily swayed. It's
not about being young. I'm going to be accountable and
be like, yeah, I fucking bought into it. So I
was probably like cool, Van rocks. I don't want to
do the van. No, I think we talked about it.
I didn't want to do the van, and it's just
did the van happen? It happened, did happen? Hm?
Speaker 1 (15:55):
I don't think I put money into the van because
I was I was very resolute in treating my crew
the right way.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
Like I don't.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
I didn't need this feel good moment of like, ooh,
I've donated charity. Like again, I do a lot of
charity work, and I donate a lot of money to charities,
and you always did and I always did. So I
was like, well, why don't you just find a charity
that you believe in and donate some of your paycheck
and then let's let a crew that's not making the
same amount of money, right that we make something, get
(16:26):
something that they're actually going to jury worked hard.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Yeah, you're right.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
So I think that was a big moment. And then
there was another big moment where.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
We skipped over boyfriends.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
No we're not no, no, okay, there was another because
it all ties together. So the other moment was when
Jason Luke and I did the cover Rolling Stone. Okay,
and I'm going to jog your memory. I came into work, Yes,
so do the boys. Yes, we were all there. Yes,
And I was in my dress room and there was
a knock on my door and there were several cast members.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
They dragged you into it as well. Me.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Yes, granted care, I know you didn't care, okay, and
set me down and said that I should not be
doing covers without the entire cast, that I should have
said no to Rolling Stone Magazine. And I was like,
why because you were the female, because I was probably
the one that they thought that would listen. I don't
(17:22):
really know they didn't say it to the boys because
I checked with Luke and Jason afterwards. I was like,
did you guys get harassed about And I spoke off
for myself and said, you guys are nuts. This is
Rolling Stone Magazine. I'm not saying no to Rolling Stone Magazine,
like there's no way, Nor am I saying no to
Fox when they asked me to do publicity.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
I'm saying yes. But that was another huge moment I
didn't I was there. I'm sorry you were.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Granted, it was three like a wall in front of me,
and you were kind of like in the back, like
sort of standing there. You had this look of pure
fear deer call in headlights, and.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
I felt really bad for you.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
But I also was like, Montana, speak up for me,
speak up, speak up, speak.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Up like I couldn't. I'm sorry you couldn't.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
That's fine, Like I'm listen, We're a lot older, we've
been through stuff, but you know, I.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Still can't speak cook for myself sometimes. So yeah, so
at fifty.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
So I'm not sure if it was those two moments
on set, if it was your boyfriend, I can't recall
the exact riff, but I'm thinking all of those things
sort of collided at one time then, and maybe it
was just so much pressure from other people that you know,
the friendship just dissipated and then you gravitated towards others.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
But here's the thing. You know, when things go down
you're in a bad relationship, you have two types of friends.
Ones that well, they all say we don't like them.
They tell you. There's ones that will kind of go
along with it in front of the bad boyfriend, and
ones that are like no. I felt like that time,
(19:13):
like Jen would always be like like screaming at him,
and it put me in a bad position. And because
he would afterwards take it out of me. You know,
she didn't have to go home with him. I did.
And I feel like you walked the line of talking
(19:34):
me through what I should do, but being okay to
his face so that I didn't get further verbillian physically abuse. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:44):
I mean you have a boyfriend that's that volatile.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
You handled it right because he likes me, Yeah, yeah,
I mean otherwise he definitely would have taken it out
on you, correct when I'm not present to stop him.
And that was something I didn't want to do, which
many times I called on you and he's like, you
have to come to the apartment now, and I did always,
always and get me. When you were with it, I
(20:12):
felt like, was I still.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
I don't know you weren't You were not really present
when I was with because that was third season, and
you know, maybe maybe part of it was I was
in your house.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
I was with you guys.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
I slept over, but not a lot, and I think
I was hiding so much of what was happening in
that relationship. Yeah, because it felt odd to have lectured
you and been like, I'm going to kill him if
you don't leave him, and then I find myself in
a very similar situation as you did.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
But you know, I got to be honest. I also
was like, how how is she not noticing certain things?
Speaker 3 (20:52):
You know? For me?
Speaker 1 (20:53):
And especially because at that point in time, you had,
you know, gravitated completely towards Jenny, who didn't have messy
of a life, you know, or seemingly didn't have as
messy of a life, and mine was for sure messy.
Yours was messy. It might have just been easier to
be with someone who you know, appeared a little bit
(21:14):
stay more stable, if you will.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
I don't think it was that. So what was it?
I think when I was young? I think I it
was whoever was the alpha more at the moment would
sway me right? And I think I couldn't stand up
for myself. I couldn't. Yeah, I didn't take ownership of anything.
(21:37):
So it's like, you know, nice, nice, nice to everyone.
But it's like, like you said, have a fucking opinion
about something, and I'm sure I did. I just didn't.
How did I not notice what was happening? Though? That's
the key thing here, right, because I mean, and there
was a lot of things to notice.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
One was, you know, that had a severe drug problem, correct,
and when when it went overboard, he was you know,
pretty abusive. And I would show up to work, you know,
four hours late because I was wrecked, I mean like
physically wrecked, and my dad would have to come and
get me out of the house. And and I've talked
(22:18):
about this before on the podcast because it felt very
odd to me that like, no one I talked to
Jason about it, that no one like paid close enough
attention to each other. Yea, yeah, and I might be
guilty of that too, right. I paid very close attention
to you. I paid really close attention to Brian and
a Luke because that was you know, my circle. And
(22:41):
Luke and I had our super combative moments, and but
it always ended up in like a loving moment. So
you guys would scream at each other. My god, we
would scream at each other and then we would beg Yeah.
It was like a real boyfriend girl from relationship. It
was so weird or brother infamous moment in the peach Pit.
(23:19):
Do you remember pants down Day and what happened?
Speaker 2 (23:23):
No, the fight outside that started inside on the set,
I don't remember inside.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
Yeah, it was like a you know, do you remember
that we would have that someone would always do like
pants down, like pants the crew.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
Nope, God, I'm gonna have to get some crew members
on here. You would have days where it was like,
you know, pants down days. Cool. Yeah, So that that
I don't know that.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Started that that fight, because I knew the crew was
pretty irritated by it. And and you know, Ginny always
wore boxer shorts underneath her skirts, like the Calvin klinb
men's white right, So I didn't think it was a
big deal that I did skirt up day because she
always found on the boxer shorts.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
But she didn't like it, that's fine. But it just spiraled,
spiraled and spilled outside, and uh, you know, Brian and
I and you were like screaming for us to stop,
and you told the boys to help, and they broke
us up and held us back, and then you know,
(24:35):
we marched our separate ways. But oh, I'm seeing it now.
It's kind of hot if I think about it right now.
Stop it. The entire thing got blamed on me, like
there was no there was no you're right, yeah, there
was no Like two people got in a fight, two
people yelled at each other, two people said you know,
horrible things to each other. I had my hair ripped
(24:58):
out with grip tape, like there was I've, you know,
photos of it. I even tried to show, like Paul Wagner,
I was like, this is what happened to me, Like
are you kidding? But it was.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
I think at that point it was so easy to
blame me. You and I weren't really tight anymore, and
so I think everybody felt that. There were some people,
I don't want to say everybody, there were some people
that felt I didn't have this sort of protection of
the producer's daughter being my best friend. It was it
(25:30):
was like all of a sudden, I became open game.
And then I heard an interview that I think you did,
and somebody told me about it. I did not hear it,
so I don't want to quote you, but it'll jog
your memory.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
That you said.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
I feel like I was responsible for Shannon getting fired
to a certain degree because I told my dad about
the fight and said something had to happen or whatever.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
Do you remember that interview? I do, but I feel
like the fight wasn't what led to firing. I think
it was a I would love to know the time
what because where I said it came right after the fight.
That is that really? Brian said that shortly after I
(26:20):
would love a timeline all set down.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
That you guys all set down in Paul Wagner's office,
which is totally a different day. Though totally different day. Yes, absolutely,
because it took time to organize everyone, like your dad
was on a phone call conference call with that with
you guys, not with us. I wasn't invited. I mean,
that's what Brice said on the podcast.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
You know, I'm pretty good with memory. I don't remember
it that way. What happened that morning that it all
went down that day was, Yeah, it was the makeup trailer.
There was you were late and I am burst in correct,
I know I'm trying to protect people, and it's like, yeah, no,
(27:07):
I am burst in.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
He didn't notice that my makeup artist was trying to
cover up all this regulation marks on my neck.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
So yes, that was the day that I was four
hours late. And then he said, yes, well, was that
the day called me the C word and a lot
of other things. By the way, I love Ian you guys,
so yeah, they're like, like, we love ion and there's
no hard feeling. Many years ago you guys thirty years ago.
And also those things that you know, people did not know.
I did not share, and so people did not know,
(27:36):
you know, why was Shannon four hours late? Like I wasn't,
like I said earlier, when I was late, you were late.
When you were late. I was late because we always
drove into work together. When we were always together, and
then overs like yeah, and then with.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
The you know that time period, if I was late,
it was because I was you know, injured or trying
to get somebody to like.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
Get sober. There was an assumption at the time was
that you were, you know, out partying out.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
Yeah, And that was the assumption that they made without
asking you, like what's going on? So I feel like, yeah,
they but that day he walked, that was the day.
So you came in on one side of the trailer,
he came in the other, and we were all in
between and the makeup chairs, and that's the day he said,
(28:36):
you're scun t And then he said, can't understand normal
thinking because we were all like what you just said her,
And then he clarified quickly, can't understand normal thinking. And
I was sitting there just it was terrified. I was
sitting in the chair. When I heard him scream, I
was like, oh my god. And all I could think
(28:57):
at the time is I knew that was going to
fire you up because you don't take shit from anyone,
so it's not like you're going to be like, Okay,
You're going to come back, which is what I love
about you. And I was like, oh god, oh man,
what's this. Oh this isn't good, especially because of me.
Speaker 1 (29:13):
How fucked up I was like, and not drunk, fucked up,
but oh just not fucked up. I had literally been
up all night with someone on crystal mess crack like
everything he can put on his body, who then went
ballistic on me. I had an ear drum that was
like bleeding. My father was freaking out. I thought my
dad was going to go over there and like murder him.
(29:35):
So for Ian to like come at me, for no
one to be like he didn't know, Hey, what are
his knops on your neck?
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Like why? Why is your ear got blood dripping from it?
Speaker 1 (29:46):
Like for no one to notice, for no one to
be like, okay, hold on, maybe this is something a
lot different. Maybe we should actually ask her if she's okay.
Maybe we should ask like, hey, what happened? Like, you're
four hours late, maybe it was only three. I'm going
to just boost it the top number of four hours.
And it really messes up all of our days and
(30:08):
to you, you know, for Ian it was messing up
like another job he had to get off work to
go to another job, like a voiceover thing that he had.
Both right, so I understood, but I think when he
came at me like that in that moment, I was
(30:29):
just so upset that somebody else was coming at me
and loosed another yeah, and that nobody and particularly that
your man was now yelling at me and nobody was
getting my back that I.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
Yeah, I was not having it rightfully. So by the ways,
(32:04):
aststattoo
This is Let's Be Clear with Shannon Doherty. Hi, everyone,
welcome to another episode of Let's Be Clear with Shannon Doherty.
You guys, be prepared, Be prepared. This is wild. Uh
Tori spelling?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Hi? Oh my god, I've never heard you say my
full name.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
I know.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
That was so weird. No, it's usually tour. Yeah, I
got you out of bed, very happy about that.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Yeah, I want to I want to ask you because
I'm curious because I know that you're like very thoughtful
about how you present stuff and do things. You don't
just do things randomly in your professional personal life, maybe
a little random, questionable, much like me. So, why did
you choose to do your podcast from your bed?
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Oh? So, here's not the thought out answer. It just happened.
The first one we did, the first episod so at
the Beverly Hills Hotel and the bed was the only option.
But then I liked it. It felt intimate. Yah, I
like it. Okay, so I'm gonna continue. But yeah, so
(01:12):
for you.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Being in the bed, it probably makes you because it
feels more intimate, probably makes you feel safer, like you
can be a safer but a little bit more raw
and vulnerable.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Correct. All right, So now now I approve of the bed.
I want I should at your dining room table at
the head of it. But at least you gave me
one I did well, you know.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
So you and I very recently flew back from Pittsburgh together.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
We did.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
My friend has a plane and he was gracious enough
because it was my birthday weekend to fly me there
and fly a couple of us back.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Because we talked a lot, I kind of was like, yeah,
here's all the points that we wanted to talk about,
So we're kind of gonna relive some of the plane.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
First of all, that plain experience was amazing. Yep, that
was so good. It's yeah, okay.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
So anyway, we were talking about our friends, probably some
of our listeners.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
We'll remember.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Lots of photos paparazzi photos of the two of us
out and about I mean, well, yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
We hit it very hard. Oh my gosh, Roxbury bar One. Wait,
can I take it back to the beginning. Yeah, please
do going out. Remember the rat party for the pilot
I believe it was at Spago, and you and I
(02:46):
went and got our hair done that day at the
salon that was at the Beverly Hills Hotel. I don't
remember that. We got our hair done and we went
and I think it was at Spago. I know it
was at Spago because there's more to this. We went
there and at the time, I was like Brian, Brian, Brian.
(03:07):
Wasn't there a time when I was like Brian, Brian Brian,
But anyway, and he was going to go with us,
and then he didn't end up and I was like spiraling,
like I thought he liked. We didn't eat as usual,
like we drank. I was underage, though, yes, so were you.
Yes we both were correct. Listen, that's what teenagers do.
(03:32):
You know, They sneak their parents sherry or like whatever
is around the house. I'm kids. I'm not saying that
you should be doing this obviously, but you know, especially
not sharing well. I mean, but we were starring on
a show. It was your show, basically you and Jason,
and we were there as filler at the moment. But
they didn't stop us from drinking alcohol at the cast party,
(03:55):
and they were all excited, and I don't think anyone
looked at anything anyway. I ended up not eating and
I was plumbing that, like, oh my god, Brian Austin
Green doesn't like me. What do I do? What do
I do? And I just remember we ended up in
the stall at Spago and you were holding my hair
and I was puking up their infamous pasta. That's how
I know it was Spago. Yeah, and you were just
(04:17):
like there were noodles just coming out and You're like,
oh my god. Yeah. So I guess I did eat
something but hadn't even. I just right and drank a
lot and then I had to get home, and I
feel like my parents wanted to ground me, but I
was like, I'm on a hit show, like it's just
like it just launched, and like this is cool and
(04:37):
like okay, but I'm really just a sixteen year old girl,
and now I'm being grounded because I puked.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Fair enough that you got grounded fair enough. And I
think I was seventeen and a half or just from
eighteen on the pilot, so I should have been grounded
as well.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
But even they tried to my dad probably was like, Babe, jam.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Maybe we weren't. I wasn't hanging out at the manor
as much yet yet. It was during season one and
season two that I think I stayed at the manor
equally as much as you stayed at my house. Correct,
And we would often walk into the manor. First off,
(05:21):
two things that always stood out to me about the
manor was a walking in and was it nan nanny
you made the food? She always left like cookies for
us in late the kitchen.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
Yeah, I remember this.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
She always loved food and she knew I was always
hungry super late at night, so she always left me.
She loved you, and I loved her too. She was
so special and took such good care of me whenever
I was there. She would like leave waters out for
us and just really try to make sure that we
were okay. So that's always very memorable to me. But
(05:55):
then one of the times we went on the elevator
to go upstairs, and do you remember the elevator doors
open on the second floor and your mother was standing
there staring at us in the elevator, and we we.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Started laughing so hard, like we could not. She always
waited up for us, but she was mad.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
She was mad we were later than normal and she
was not happy about it.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
And she was right.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
The thing was like, we needed to at least call
and let someone know that we were going to be
that late or take security or like something.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
But I was petrified. But you were a year and
a half older. That was your responsibility, right technically, but
I had also never been out. I love that You're
like we didn't call like she was like, it was
both of us, but it was That's how my parents
felt about Shan Like it was like literally, yeah, it
was their kids, it was both of us were supposed
(06:58):
to call it.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
We had a responsibility, and when neither one of us
did it, Candy would get upset. Yeah, fair enough that
she got upset. God, those were like wild times. And
(07:23):
those infamous photos of I said to Roxbury with Brian
and Marky Mark flipping off the photographers and then just
other ones of us walking out again laughing. I think
you and I for two seasons did a lot of
laughing until we didn't because of boyfriends. Fair a lot
(07:46):
of laughing, a lot of laughing for the soul. I mean,
we were best friends. We were sisters, correct, like hardcore sisters.
And I know your dad got really upset with me
about something and I told this story when Brian I think,
was on the podcast and and I came to your
(08:07):
house and security didn't really want to let me in
because your dad was super mad at me. But your
mom saw me. I guess I'm like cameras, so she
told him to let me in, and then she waited
for me, you know how like you pulled in guard
gate and then he pulled the left, and I pulled
to the right and parking right there, and the door
would go into like the hallway and then the kitchen right.
(08:28):
So your mom was standing there waiting for me again,
and she said, I don't care what is ever happening
between you and my husband. You're always welcome to my
home and hugs me and I she never said that
to me.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
She was the favorite child, so that's that's okay. You
were daddy's girl, fair, Yeah, you were daddy's girl. So
we were you know, listen, if you were late, I
was late. If I was like you were late, yep,
because we were always together and and we were definitely
late a few times. Yes, And some cast members didn't
(09:07):
really like that, which I understand as well, but I
always got the brunt of it you did because they're
not going to say something to the producer's daughter, correct,
And at the time that is something that I didn't
see right because I couldn't you know, I was in it.
It was hard to see. And I prided myself when
(09:27):
I started that show being on time because I was like,
everyone's going to hate me. I'm the producer's daughter. I
have to be on time. And then you know, we
all got comfortable and we got this big life suddenly
that exploded quickly. Yes, and we were young, Like when
you're that young, you don't have I don't think you
have the mental capacity to fully process what's happening in
(09:50):
a really healthy way. You can't. Possibly. We weren't developed.
We were teenagers my kids' ages, you know, And I
can't imagine the responsibility that we had giving to my kids,
my fifteen six year old right now, and like come
to Harold and I'm like, whoa, can we go back
(10:11):
to the Brian market mark picture real quick? So that picture,
like it was different back then. You guys like paparazzi
didn't follow you everywhere. They would be at like certain
places like nightclubs, restaurants, and they would say do you
mind taking a picture? They would ask you usually when
you came in or out, but that day they were
(10:32):
like ravenous because it was the four of us. We
were up in the VIP room. We thought it was
blacked out windows correct, and someone's like, oh, they're taking pictures.
Were like, oh, whatever, and we flipped them off all
four of us and the four of us at the
same time because we were like, they can't see this meanwhile,
full on picture like yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
And went everywhere, everywhere, absolutely everywhere. There's only one other
picture from nine oh to and oho that I remember
went everywhere was Jason and I making out at like
an after party for an award show, and that thing
went everywhere too, and I was like, oh, I'm making
out with my brother.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
This is not good. It was always hot when that happened.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
But yeah, so we had a ridiculous amount of fun
we did. And again like sisters, like best friends. And
then I remember you had We both got boyfriends that
ended up being friends and they weren't great, No, they
were not good. Both had a lot of issues. They
(11:34):
were better to each other than they were to us. Yeah,
so good thing. And I think what we were trying
to figure out on the plane is what was the
pivotal moment that because it's like one minute we were friends,
and then one minute we weren't. Yeah, And you know,
I think from my perspective as I was looking in now,
(11:56):
being an outsider, I saw that you were swayed by
two certain individuals, and particularly one and it.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
Was I'm swear huh you know I'm as swear. Yeah, yes,
my downfall. Yeah yeah, you were always easily swayed.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
And it was very frustrating for me because I always
used to tell you, like now tour have an opinion,
like you're smart, you're funny, you're talented. I loved you
and I respected you, and I wanted you to believe
in yourself as much as I believed in you. So
then seeing you like get swayed and our friendship ending.
But we on the plane, we're trying to figure out
(12:35):
what was the weak point where you were able to
be swayed, and and I kind of just went, I can't,
I can't keep fighting for this. And I think it
was your boyfriend. Really, I do I think he was
because he was he was abusive, abusive, and I, yeah,
like very believed physically. I remember we went to Mexico
(12:58):
with our boyfriends pictures, and I mean Mexico. You know
you called me crying, like from your room, and you
came to my room, and there was a point I
specifically remember looking at you and saying, you have to
end it with him or I'm going to actually kill him,
Like I can't, I can't stand by and watch this.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
So I could be in jail.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
And all I can think is that because you you
didn't break out with him, you you stayed and you
got tortured for a little bit longer. But did I wait,
I'm trying to but we sort of started drifting apart.
I don't know if that was it. I don't know
if you know, you started listening to those other people.
(13:47):
I don't know if it was. There were so many
really interesting moments about like that time in the show
and in our relationship, because there was this whole conversation
about what to buy the crew for Christmas as a cast,
and somebody, one of the cast members, suggested a van
that we would then donate to charity, like we were used
(14:09):
a van and we would all, you know, donate like
fifteen hundred dollars for the van and then donate it
to charity in the name of the crew. And I
was like, I'll just donate money directly to a charity.
But I'm not I'm not doing this to my crew, Like, yeah,
what does that get them?
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Gets them?
Speaker 1 (14:26):
You know, they want a party, they want T shirts,
they want hats, they want you know, a DVD player
if there were DVDs back then. Maybe they were laser
disc I don't know, but like or vhs things Walkman
Walkman's But and I remember we ended up still doing
a party and the crew was so thankful that they
got to like just hang out and let loose and
(14:47):
have free drinks and free food and a DJ and
like party and have fun. But I know that that
caused a huge rift between me and three of the
cast members.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Let's all coming back, is it okay? So tell me
what's coming back to you. I don't know. I remember
that particular moment that I was really conflicted because I
had everyone coming at me like to be on this
side or that side? Is like why? And it was
one against many and I was young and young you
(15:34):
know what? Fuck that? Sorry, I got easily swayed. It's
not about being young. I'm going to be accountable and
be like, yeah, I fucking bought into it. So I
was probably like cool, Van rocks. I don't want to
do the van. No, I think we talked about it.
I didn't want to do the van, and it's just
did the van happen? It happened, did happen? Hm?
Speaker 1 (15:55):
I don't think I put money into the van because
I was I was very resolute in treating my crew
the right way.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
Like I don't.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
I didn't need this feel good moment of like, ooh,
I've donated charity. Like again, I do a lot of
charity work, and I donate a lot of money to charities,
and you always did and I always did. So I
was like, well, why don't you just find a charity
that you believe in and donate some of your paycheck
and then let's let a crew that's not making the
same amount of money, right that we make something, get
(16:26):
something that they're actually going to jury worked hard.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Yeah, you're right.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
So I think that was a big moment. And then
there was another big moment where.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
We skipped over boyfriends.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
No we're not no, no, okay, there was another because
it all ties together. So the other moment was when
Jason Luke and I did the cover Rolling Stone. Okay,
and I'm going to jog your memory. I came into work, Yes,
so do the boys. Yes, we were all there. Yes,
And I was in my dress room and there was
a knock on my door and there were several cast members.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
They dragged you into it as well. Me.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Yes, granted care, I know you didn't care, okay, and
set me down and said that I should not be
doing covers without the entire cast, that I should have
said no to Rolling Stone Magazine. And I was like,
why because you were the female, because I was probably
the one that they thought that would listen. I don't
(17:22):
really know they didn't say it to the boys because
I checked with Luke and Jason afterwards. I was like,
did you guys get harassed about And I spoke off
for myself and said, you guys are nuts. This is
Rolling Stone Magazine. I'm not saying no to Rolling Stone Magazine,
like there's no way, Nor am I saying no to
Fox when they asked me to do publicity.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
I'm saying yes. But that was another huge moment I
didn't I was there. I'm sorry you were.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Granted, it was three like a wall in front of me,
and you were kind of like in the back, like
sort of standing there. You had this look of pure
fear deer call in headlights, and.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
I felt really bad for you.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
But I also was like, Montana, speak up for me,
speak up, speak up, speak.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Up like I couldn't. I'm sorry you couldn't.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
That's fine, Like I'm listen, We're a lot older, we've
been through stuff, but you know, I.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Still can't speak cook for myself sometimes. So yeah, so
at fifty.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
So I'm not sure if it was those two moments
on set, if it was your boyfriend, I can't recall
the exact riff, but I'm thinking all of those things
sort of collided at one time then, and maybe it
was just so much pressure from other people that you know,
the friendship just dissipated and then you gravitated towards others.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
But here's the thing. You know, when things go down
you're in a bad relationship, you have two types of friends.
Ones that well, they all say we don't like them.
They tell you. There's ones that will kind of go
along with it in front of the bad boyfriend, and
ones that are like no. I felt like that time,
(19:13):
like Jen would always be like like screaming at him,
and it put me in a bad position. And because
he would afterwards take it out of me. You know,
she didn't have to go home with him. I did.
And I feel like you walked the line of talking
(19:34):
me through what I should do, but being okay to
his face so that I didn't get further verbillian physically abuse. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:44):
I mean you have a boyfriend that's that volatile.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
You handled it right because he likes me, Yeah, yeah,
I mean otherwise he definitely would have taken it out
on you, correct when I'm not present to stop him.
And that was something I didn't want to do, which
many times I called on you and he's like, you
have to come to the apartment now, and I did always,
always and get me. When you were with it, I
(20:12):
felt like, was I still.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
I don't know you weren't You were not really present
when I was with because that was third season, and
you know, maybe maybe part of it was I was
in your house.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
I was with you guys.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
I slept over, but not a lot, and I think
I was hiding so much of what was happening in
that relationship. Yeah, because it felt odd to have lectured
you and been like, I'm going to kill him if
you don't leave him, and then I find myself in
a very similar situation as you did.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
But you know, I got to be honest. I also
was like, how how is she not noticing certain things?
Speaker 3 (20:52):
You know? For me?
Speaker 1 (20:53):
And especially because at that point in time, you had,
you know, gravitated completely towards Jenny, who didn't have messy
of a life, you know, or seemingly didn't have as
messy of a life, and mine was for sure messy.
Yours was messy. It might have just been easier to
be with someone who you know, appeared a little bit
(21:14):
stay more stable, if you will.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
I don't think it was that. So what was it?
I think when I was young? I think I it
was whoever was the alpha more at the moment would
sway me right? And I think I couldn't stand up
for myself. I couldn't. Yeah, I didn't take ownership of anything.
(21:37):
So it's like, you know, nice, nice, nice to everyone.
But it's like, like you said, have a fucking opinion
about something, and I'm sure I did. I just didn't.
How did I not notice what was happening? Though? That's
the key thing here, right, because I mean, and there
was a lot of things to notice.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
One was, you know, that had a severe drug problem, correct,
and when when it went overboard, he was you know,
pretty abusive. And I would show up to work, you know,
four hours late because I was wrecked, I mean like
physically wrecked, and my dad would have to come and
get me out of the house. And and I've talked
(22:18):
about this before on the podcast because it felt very
odd to me that like, no one I talked to
Jason about it, that no one like paid close enough
attention to each other. Yea, yeah, and I might be
guilty of that too, right. I paid very close attention
to you. I paid really close attention to Brian and
a Luke because that was you know, my circle. And
(22:41):
Luke and I had our super combative moments, and but
it always ended up in like a loving moment. So
you guys would scream at each other. My god, we
would scream at each other and then we would beg Yeah.
It was like a real boyfriend girl from relationship. It
was so weird or brother infamous moment in the peach Pit.
(23:19):
Do you remember pants down Day and what happened?
Speaker 2 (23:23):
No, the fight outside that started inside on the set,
I don't remember inside.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
Yeah, it was like a you know, do you remember
that we would have that someone would always do like
pants down, like pants the crew.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
Nope, God, I'm gonna have to get some crew members
on here. You would have days where it was like,
you know, pants down days. Cool. Yeah, So that that
I don't know that.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Started that that fight, because I knew the crew was
pretty irritated by it. And and you know, Ginny always
wore boxer shorts underneath her skirts, like the Calvin klinb
men's white right, So I didn't think it was a
big deal that I did skirt up day because she
always found on the boxer shorts.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
But she didn't like it, that's fine. But it just spiraled,
spiraled and spilled outside, and uh, you know, Brian and
I and you were like screaming for us to stop,
and you told the boys to help, and they broke
us up and held us back, and then you know,
(24:35):
we marched our separate ways. But oh, I'm seeing it now.
It's kind of hot if I think about it right now.
Stop it. The entire thing got blamed on me, like
there was no there was no you're right, yeah, there
was no Like two people got in a fight, two
people yelled at each other, two people said you know,
horrible things to each other. I had my hair ripped
(24:58):
out with grip tape, like there was I've, you know,
photos of it. I even tried to show, like Paul Wagner,
I was like, this is what happened to me, Like
are you kidding? But it was.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
I think at that point it was so easy to
blame me. You and I weren't really tight anymore, and
so I think everybody felt that. There were some people,
I don't want to say everybody, there were some people
that felt I didn't have this sort of protection of
the producer's daughter being my best friend. It was it
(25:30):
was like all of a sudden, I became open game.
And then I heard an interview that I think you did,
and somebody told me about it. I did not hear it,
so I don't want to quote you, but it'll jog
your memory.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
That you said.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
I feel like I was responsible for Shannon getting fired
to a certain degree because I told my dad about
the fight and said something had to happen or whatever.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
Do you remember that interview? I do, but I feel
like the fight wasn't what led to firing. I think
it was a I would love to know the time
what because where I said it came right after the fight.
That is that really? Brian said that shortly after I
(26:20):
would love a timeline all set down.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
That you guys all set down in Paul Wagner's office,
which is totally a different day. Though totally different day. Yes, absolutely,
because it took time to organize everyone, like your dad
was on a phone call conference call with that with
you guys, not with us. I wasn't invited. I mean,
that's what Brice said on the podcast.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
You know, I'm pretty good with memory. I don't remember
it that way. What happened that morning that it all
went down that day was, Yeah, it was the makeup trailer.
There was you were late and I am burst in correct,
I know I'm trying to protect people, and it's like, yeah, no,
(27:07):
I am burst in.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
He didn't notice that my makeup artist was trying to
cover up all this regulation marks on my neck.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
So yes, that was the day that I was four
hours late. And then he said, yes, well, was that
the day called me the C word and a lot
of other things. By the way, I love Ian you guys,
so yeah, they're like, like, we love ion and there's
no hard feeling. Many years ago you guys thirty years ago.
And also those things that you know, people did not know.
I did not share, and so people did not know,
(27:36):
you know, why was Shannon four hours late? Like I wasn't,
like I said earlier, when I was late, you were late.
When you were late. I was late because we always
drove into work together. When we were always together, and
then overs like yeah, and then with.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
The you know that time period, if I was late,
it was because I was you know, injured or trying
to get somebody to like.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
Get sober. There was an assumption at the time was
that you were, you know, out partying out.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
Yeah, And that was the assumption that they made without
asking you, like what's going on? So I feel like, yeah,
they but that day he walked, that was the day.
So you came in on one side of the trailer,
he came in the other, and we were all in
between and the makeup chairs, and that's the day he said,
(28:36):
you're scun t And then he said, can't understand normal
thinking because we were all like what you just said her,
And then he clarified quickly, can't understand normal thinking. And
I was sitting there just it was terrified. I was
sitting in the chair. When I heard him scream, I
was like, oh my god. And all I could think
(28:57):
at the time is I knew that was going to
fire you up because you don't take shit from anyone,
so it's not like you're going to be like, Okay,
You're going to come back, which is what I love
about you. And I was like, oh god, oh man,
what's this. Oh this isn't good, especially because of me.
Speaker 1 (29:13):
How fucked up I was like, and not drunk, fucked up,
but oh just not fucked up. I had literally been
up all night with someone on crystal mess crack like
everything he can put on his body, who then went
ballistic on me. I had an ear drum that was
like bleeding. My father was freaking out. I thought my
dad was going to go over there and like murder him.
(29:35):
So for Ian to like come at me, for no
one to be like he didn't know, Hey, what are
his knops on your neck?
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Like why? Why is your ear got blood dripping from it?
Speaker 1 (29:46):
Like for no one to notice, for no one to
be like, okay, hold on, maybe this is something a
lot different. Maybe we should actually ask her if she's okay.
Maybe we should ask like, hey, what happened? Like, you're
four hours late, maybe it was only three. I'm going
to just boost it the top number of four hours.
And it really messes up all of our days and
(30:08):
to you, you know, for Ian it was messing up
like another job he had to get off work to
go to another job, like a voiceover thing that he had.
Both right, so I understood, but I think when he
came at me like that in that moment, I was
(30:29):
just so upset that somebody else was coming at me
and loosed another yeah, and that nobody and particularly that
your man was now yelling at me and nobody was
getting my back that I.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
Yeah, I was not having it rightfully. So by the ways,
(32:04):
aststattoo
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