Electricity, appliance, water heater, heating unit, Electric bill question

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    I recently moved and the place I'm living in now has surprised me with monstrous SMUD bills. I know I'm not using that much power.  I have 3 kids but they are in school during the day and when they come home they are very considerate (not in a particular room, lights should be out).  I don't run my heater like I'm trying to have tropical weather here and even the dishwasher is used maybe once every 2-3 days as I wash my dishes by hand.  I use my oven to do a lot of my cooking but I always have anywhere I've lived in and the bill was never like this.  I called SMUD and the customer service rep went ahead and had someone check the meter and told me what I had supposedly used in the past 3 days and what my bill (at that consumption rate) would be like for next month and THAT WAS INSANE.

    My question and work with me because I don't know how to ask it very well...

    Is there someone I can call to see where all this power is being used from? I'm telling you it's like I am providing electricity to at least 2 more homes. Could the appliances be too old? Water heater not working properly? Heating unit clogged or something? Basically where do I start to find what is wrong? Because something is definitely wrong.

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    Its probably an old refrigerator....that can soak $20 or more per month, if the compressor is always "on" you will hear it running constantly.

    If the water heater is electric, try turning the unit down a notch.  

    Typical SMUD customer should not be paying more than $50 per month for electricity.

    We're on PGE and our bills right now (for a 2,400 s/f home) are averaging $65.

    One more suggestion -- REPLACE ALL YOUR LIGHT BULBS to CFL (compact florescent lamps) as the old incandescents will soak up 70% of a typical electric bill.

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    William, I'm on SMUD only, would PG&E still come even though they are not the service used here?

    Matt I will have the refrigerator checked and most of the light bulbs that are mainly used (livingroom, outdoors, kitchen, dining room are already CFL. The only ones that aren't are the ones in the bathrooms and those are used on a need to basis (showers, bathroom use, etc)  

    :(  My bill this month was over $200. so at your $50. estimate then I am providing electricity to over 4 places.  At my other place it was always high but I washed and dried clothes every day (here I don't do that), I ran my heater/AC quite often too.  

    Thank you both I will be looking into all of that this week.

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    Probably not but there is no harm in asking.

    As far as the cost of lighting.
    If you used ten 60 watt bulbs for ten hours a day at a cost of 11 cents per kilowatt hour, your bill would be less than $20 dollars per month.

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    Thought I'd mention here that my most recent SMUD bill was outrageous! It was almost twice as high, making me think I skipped a payment... Betty- you know me, and we are pretty green too-Great questions!

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    Another thing, houses are not generally as efficient as apartments because you share communal walls.  Upstairs apartments usually cost twice as much to heat as downstairs apartment because cold falls.  You are basically already surrounded by conditioned spaces.

    I would say that it has a lot to do with your windows, and insulation plus how much cold is sneaking in under and around your doors.  It could be costing you a lot to keep your house heated to even 68 degrees.  We have had a lot of cold nights and mornings in the last month.  If you have an old ineffient  heat system it can cost you a fortune.  Specially those old wall furnaces and if you have wall furnaces without the built in fans you might as well be giving your money away.  Add an uninsulated attic and you might as well be living in a tent with portable heaters.

    With electric water heaters you are not saving by hand washing your dishes.  The cost of the extra hot water can be as much as running the dishwasher.

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    That would be a false assumption David.  Unless the upstairs apartment is unoccupied the downstairs apartment is usually cheaper to heat.   When I lived in apartment I alway tried to get a downstairs one and my winter energy bills were usually half of my upstairs neighbors.  With the upstairs unit already being conditioned space and two layers of building material between the units, the warm air is trapped below.

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    Joe I just found that out, that washing dishes by hand and using hot water is not saving me anything.  Now if I use the dishwasher and "air dry" instead of heat dry, that should drop right? But on top of using the energy it takes for using it, does the dishwasher use hot water too?  Basically using more or perhaps breaking even?  I'm curious.

    My place was built a while back so Joe all of the things you are saying re: old heating system, wall events, etc all apply.  :(

    Because of the way my electric bill has been, my kids come home, change their socks to non sweaty ones, put on sweats and sweatshirts and I keep set the heater to kick in if it goes below 68 instead of having it stay on at 68 all the time.  

    I'm having someone come in on Monday to check all of my appliances, water heater, heating unit.  

    Another quick question, would it be cheaper say to buy an electric heater to use in only the rooms that are occupied instead of cranking the heater that goes all over although I have bathroom, kitchen, dining room vents closed?  Example: while my kids are up we spend time in the livingroom so turning on a heater there and when they go to bed (my 2 boys share a room) turning on 2 heaters for a bit?

    Like more than one of you said I also think the windows, doors, sliding doors, etc may be letting in cold air.  Mostly in the bedrooms though because even when the livingroom is warm (maybe body heat??) the rooms are freezing.

    Everyone, I really appreciate all of the information and suggestions.  Thank you for taking the time.  I pay my bills on time (most of the time), as I have mentioned I provide for 3 kids and it is not the easiest thing to do so when I get freak out bills like this I have to start re-arranging my budget and it overwhelms me a little to think that I may get stuck without the ability to pay a bill and then having it add on fees or having it be disconnected. So I am so grateful that you have all taken the time.  :)

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    If you plan on living there awhile you can have SMUD rework your bill so it is slightly higher during other parts of the year so it is not so high during the cold months.  Luckily the coldest part of the year will be over in a few weeks.  I am not sure you are going to save anything with small room heaters.  

    The dishwasher uses a lot less hot water than you do when you hand wash.  The newer ones are way more efficient of course.

    Get some heavy window coverings from a second hand store.  You will be surprised how much it will help.  I have heard that seran wrap over the windows helps but I do not have any first hand knowledge.We have a coating of gila over ours and it seems to help.  Get up on a chair and see how warm it is near the ceilings, maybe a ceiling fan might help.

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    Betty--

    SMUD might offer an "energy audit" like PG&E's program. See if they can send someone out to evaluate your home and appliances.

    Your bill might be accurate. I pay about $50 in SMUD for 1 person, and you've got 4 people and probably a larger place. I keep the heat around 68 most of the time, but my heat is gas/electric. So, my PGE bill also shoots up in the winter (it's $50-60 in winter, but only $8 in the summer). So my grand total in winter is around $100/month. I use mostly CFLs, don't have a ton of appliances (no dishwasher, energy efficient W/D), and turn shit off when I'm not in the room. My AC is 100% SMUD, but I hardly ever use it. Even so, my summer SMUD bill is sometimes $40. So, that should give you a benchmark.

    Depending on your income level, you might also qualify for some of their programs that help families. Might be worth checking out.

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    I just googled it. Here's what SMUD has on their website--I haven't done this, so I don't know if it costs $$ or is helpful:

    hpp.smud.org/homeowner

    Independent Home Energy Rating
    If you prefer to learn about your home's energy health by an independent evaluator, choose an Independent Home Energy Rating. You'll learn about your home's energy performance and receive its energy rating.

    Interested in talking to SMUD about which option is right for you? Call a customer service representative at 1-888-742-7683 and press *18.

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    Maybe your neighbor is tapping into your line to be an urban farmer.

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    People crack me up.  I doubt if CFL's save anyone more than $2.00 a month.  Do the math.  On top of that they give off shitty light and create very harzardous waste.  Ever heard of mercury?  LED's on the other hand are completely amazing.

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    All I know is my smud bill is $200+ every month and my place is like 1200 square feet!

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    However my PG&E is only like $20.

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    Thanks again everyone.  I actually printed this page and highlighted all the stuff to look into.  

    Marina, thank you for the website and suggestions.  I asked about "help" but didn't qualify.  Your bill times 4 people seems accurate.  I almost lost it when Matt said average bill should be 50. I've never had any bill (not even water-sewer-garbage) be that low.  I just think my new SMUD bills are very high and something is wrong.

    Joe about those lights... the lights I have here are the type that when you turn on the switch they start increasing brightness slowly (kind of annoying) because they were the ones recommended. Are those the CFL?  Now I'm confused.  I definitely do not need anything that is going to be hazardous.  So the whole "light" thing is BS? I like the idea of putting up window coverings (you mean thick drapes?).  

    Brad I don't know if it has a "smart meter" but I will find out also.

    After getting all this done... I hope to see some difference, even a little.  In the meantime I guess I have to estimate a high monthly SMUD bill so as not to be caught off guard.

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    Betty, it might be more cost effective to buy a portable heater if the family stays in one area.
    I don't know if your losin heat from not having enough insulation or window coverings.
    Hot water heater should have a blankie.
    You can check for drafts using an insence and walking around. Have someone come check out for HVAC ventilation to make sure they are clean and not causing your heater to work harder.
    Using the dishwasher saves you time, money an water. Is your place carpeted, vinyl, linoleum, or wood.
    What are your windows like, single or double pane?

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    Minh, yes during the day we spend lots of time in the living room doing stuff.

    The windows are single (very thin too) sliding windows.  The floor is carpeted everywhere but the kitchen, dining room and bathrooms.  

    A blankie?  I'll ask about that tomorrow when they come check it out.  

    I'll use that idea (insence) to check.

    Wow, I am so glad I came here to ask.

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    Window coverings or just blinds?
    If you can find the drafts, most likely the windows and doors, caulking will do the job. Also the amount of furniture helps to keep heat in. An empty room doesn't retain as much heat, if this is the case since you've just moved in. I recommend a ceramic unidirectional heater if you go portable.

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    CFLs are just fine. They aren't quite as energy-efficient as the newest LED bulbs, but they use about a fifth what an incandescent bulb of equivalent brightness does. They contain a miniscule amount of mercury--but the amount of mercury in a CFL is actually less than the amount of mercury released into the atmosphere by the coal burnt to generate the extra electricity needed to light an equivalent incandescent bulb. Also, CFL bulbs can be recycled--most hardware stores have a place you can drop them off--which reuses the mercury. So if you can go without the old-fashioned joys of smashing old light bulbs, they are perfectly safe--and not particularly unsafe even if they do break.

    And yeah, a few bucks' worth of caulk and weatherstripping to eliminate drafts can pay for itself very rapidly. In winter, you can get kits to add an inner "storm window" of thin plastic that makes a big difference (the air space is the insulator.)

    I think what Minh meant by a "blankie" is an insulating layer over the water heater (hardware stores sell them) although you might just try turning the thermostat on the water heater down, especially if it's set on "grandma-scalding hot."

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    William, you really need to get your facts straight on CFL's.  You are not even close.

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    The claim is that one 13 watt cfl supposedly replaces one 60 watt incandescent  bulb but in actuality if you test it with a light meter, it takes two 13 watt cfl to get the same light as one 40 watt incandescent.  In other words, don't believe everything you read.  It still kills my eyes to read under them.  

    If you replace your other appliances with energy star, you will save more in one month than you will in years with cfl's.  If you look around, LED's have come down in price and they usually last ten or more years.  The savings will more than make up for their extra price.  I bought a six pack for under twenty dollars.  Guess what, mo mercury, no dealing with where to recycle them.  No mercury loss during recyclying.  No chance of mercury if you accidentally break it.

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    Well, crud. I've been methodically swapping out the old incandescent bulbs with CFLs over the past year. I thought I was saving the world! Ok, not really, but I thought it was a good idea.

    I'm not a fan of harsh LEDs, though.

    Joe is such a buzzkill.

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    I'll take your old incandescent bulbs!

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    Minh, I meant, when the incandescents burn out, I replace them with CFLs. You want burnt out bulbs? I'll be more than happy to give them to you! ;-)

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    Since it is a requirement that you have flourescents in the kitchen and baths, I have replaced my old magnetic ballast fixtures with electronic ballasts.  I think the difference in the quality of light is phenomenal and you do save a little on electricity too.

    A quick and easy fix for cold air coming in under the doors are door snakes.  I think you can still get them at Target.

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    Another thing to think about is that your old wooden exterior doors may be warped and changing the weather stripping is not going to stop the air infiltration.

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    Maybe I missed it, but is the OP renting or do they own the property? Obviously being a renter limits the number of things a person can do to the property--caulk and weatherstripping and lightbulbs and drapes etcetera. Replacing doors or adding insulation may not be an option, but there are all sorts of cheap ways to limit drafts.

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    Like door snakes William.

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    The old Victorians and homes in midtown are notorious for unleveled floors and warped doors. If you have a chimney, that also brings a good draft and loss of heat in the home.

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    Hey Pete. WTF???

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    I agree with you Peete.  The SC sucks.  Do they still do Jeep caravans up dried up streams in the summer time?  If you find a really warped front door, a SC member probably lives there.

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    Today I had my water heater checked-- it was too high. The guy lowered it.
    The seal on my oven door was a little messed up so I'm having that replaced.
    The refrigerator seemed fine to the guy although he just looked at the seal and underneath. OK
    I have a draft coming in from the bottom of my front door, for now I'm going with a door snake.
    I'm having a heater guy come in and check that out this week too.

    The guy that checked my appliances said that also my heat may be working harder because of the high ceilings-- having the heat rise then stay up there. I put in a new filter. The other one was not too bad but I changed it anyway just in case.  I normally change those every month and a half to 2 depending on how bad they get.

    Really everyone, thank you so much for all the suggestions and helpful responses.  I got a lot out of this thread.  Even if I end up spending a little on all of this stuff now, I know that in the long run it should hopefully pay off.

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    If you have high ceilings, then you probably should have a ceiling fan.  Hopefull you already have a ceiling light.  You seem like the handy type, so you could do it yourself for fifty bucks.  You can always change it back when you decide to move.  Dont forget to use a fan rated box.

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    The home show at Cal Expo this weekend would have been a great place to have your questions answered.  They have reps from both PG&E and SMUD along with a lot of different home contractors that specialize in saving you energy.

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    You can ask a bunch of computer geeks on yelp or you can get tips from the real experts.

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