A Sophomore’s Naive Foray Into Finance and the Interview Question That Kickstarted My Entire Career Path

The interview question that kickstarted my entire career was asked by a finance leader in Standard & Poors (S&P) Valuation Practice. Ironically, it wasn't an interview with a happy ending.

"How would you describe your financial modeling skills?" he asked me.

"What's financial modeling?" I asked in response.

He stared at me blankly. It wasn't an "aw, that's cute that he doesn't know" kind of look. There was no grin. It was the look of a man who'd just met the greenest college Sophomore ever. And clearly, that was the beginning of the end of the interview. He was kind enough to continue the small talk.

But not surprisingly, I didn't get the internship.

Get embarrassed? Get obsessed.

Have you ever had the feeling when you know you should be embarrassed, but you're so naive that you don't even know what to be embarrassed about?

Yes, that was me.

As a young student, I was getting my first exposure to the world of accounting. I had just learned what debits and credits were, the three financial statements, and I had little understanding of what was required of a working professional in corporate finance.

Given how shocked this interviewer was by my blissfully ignorant answer, I got the hint that financial modeling was important and that I'd better learn it. So, I went on Internet Explorer (yes, that was the leading search engine at the time) and researched financial modeling. I discovered that the books on the topic were mostly about Excel and investment banking.

"What's investment banking?" I wondered to myself.

I went to the business library and the university and downloaded the definitive guide to investment banking to learn what the field was all about. Aside from the details of the job, I learned that it was very competitive with a low acceptance rate. To young me, that meant that it must be a good job.

Monkey Business

Around that time, a book that was making a huge splash in the corporate finance world was Monkey Business: Swinging Through the Wall Street Jungle. It was a memoir written by John Rolfe and Peter Troob about their hard-to-believe experiences as Analysts at Donaldson, Lufkin & Jenrette (commonly known as DLJ, which was acquired by Credit Suisse for more than $11 billion). Despite the craziness of the stories in the book, I was curious about the prospects of working in such an environment. After all, if I could work there and learn financial modeling, it would be worth it, right?

So I reached out to the recruiters at the top investment banks -- Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs, UBS, and Jeffries among others. And yes...Credit Suisse because I saw the name in Monkey Business. Crickets. I received hardly any responses, but for a few recruiters did respond and had the thoughtfulness to tell me I didn't go to a target school. My short-lived wonder about investment banking evaporated and I explored other avenues for getting good at financial modeling.

Next on the list was management consulting.

Consulting Firms with Big Names

My financial modeling research led me to the big management consulting firms -- McKinsey, Bain, Booz, and others. The work they did sounded fascinating, solving unique problems that businesses face and coming up with innovative solutions. Also, the stories I'd heard about working in a cubicle doing the same work day in and day out, were silenced by the idea of going from one engagement to the next and living out of hotels as a road warrior.

But as interesting as consulting sounded, I soon learned that just as my university wasn't a target school for investment banking, it wasn't a target school for the big-name management consulting firms either.

Business Fraternity to the Rescue

It was around this time that I joined a coed business fraternity. Its focus was building relationships, learning about business, inviting alumni and working professionals to come speak, and setting up members with internships and full-time jobs.

Among some of my better friends was a girl named Laura, who was an accounting major. She threw around big names like Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu, Arthur Andersen, and others. And when I went back onto the career services center website, I saw another name I recognized.

PricewaterhouseCoopers.

A Slight Detour

I knew nothing about this firm with a long name aside from them overseeing the briefcases at the Academy Awards (which would eventually backfire on them in 2017 when they failed to oversee it very well). I went back onto Internet Explorer and learned that they did consulting. But of course, they were most well known for their audit and tax practices.

The interview at PwC was with the assurance practice, which I came to learn was a fancy word for auditing. Being the naive finance major that I was, I applied for the internship interview thinking that it would be easy to get one job and then transfer soon after to the one in consulting that I wanted.

Months later, when the interview finally came, I inquired of the audit Partner how I might be able to transfer into a consulting internship. He kindly shared that it wouldn't be possible for an internship, but that down the road it could be done. A few days later, I received a warm hand-written note from the Partner extending me an internship offer in Detroit and hoping that I would accept it.

I did.

A Lesson in Learning What I Didn't Want to Do

While internships ideally reveal to us what we might like to do and hopefully line us up with a full-time job offer, this experience was no such thing. My fear was realized as I spent weeks auditing the financial services arm of an automotive company -- from one seat within a sea of cubicles. The combination of the environment, as well as the work itself, revealed to me that I DID NOT want to do auditing.

But at the conclusion of two months, PwC offered me, as a Sophomore, the opportunity to do another internship the next year, followed by a full-time offer. It seemed like such a sweet deal, except that I didn't want to do the work. I wanted to do consulting so I could get better at financial modeling.

I asked the Partner and HR whether I could do an internship in consulting the following year instead of audit. And the answer was a resounding no.

Should I Give Up?

At this point, you may be wondering: Was all this effort simply because of that one interview with S&P?

Admittedly, yes.

Despite the ignorance of that interview answer, in the ensuing months, I learned just how many finance and consulting roles identified financial modeling as a critical skill. I became obsessed with learning it, and I was committed to getting a job that would accelerate that learning and development.

PwC Gives an Option

I never went back to PwC for that second audit internship. And I never took their full-time offer in audit. But I continued to be adamant about working in consulting. I pleaded with audit HR in Detroit to connect with the consulting HR in Chicago. Refusing to take no for an answer, I continued to push until the introduction was made.

HR in Chicago was supportive and offered interviews for full-time positions in various advisory practices. But I was told that the number of hires made in those practices would be significantly lower than the numbers for audit and tax. In other words, don't get your hopes up.

But then it happened. I had interviews with the Dispute Analysis & Investigations group. The Partners, Senior Manager, and Managers I met with all told me the one thing I wanted to hear.

"There's a lot of financial modeling required." I was sold and made it abundantly clear how much I wanted the job. They reminded me that open slots for new hires were extremely limited.

A week later, I was offered the job, and I said yes to joining the Intellectual Asset Management practice, the group that specialized in modeling and valuation of copyrights, trademarks, patents, and more.

The Best Choice I Could Have Made

I loved my time at PwC. I loved the group I worked in. And I loved the people I worked with. I got to be surrounded by sharp, driven, and fun finance professionals. When the recession came in 2007 and the years that followed, the group disbanded and much of the team went its separate ways. But when I look back to the place and the people who taught me the foundations of financial modeling, it was there. That was the spark that led to everything thereafter.

Every Journey Begins with a Spark

I believe we can all look back on the linear or non-linear path that brought us to where we are today. When I look back on my two-decade-plus career and review the imperfect route I've taken, I recall the steps at the time seeming scattershot and disconnected. But all these years later, I can pinpoint everything back to a couple of moments.

After I left PwC, I joined a turnaround and restructuring boutique. But I stayed in touch with several of my old colleagues and thanked them for their coaching and mentorship. It was that support, at that firm and in that group, that positioned me well for what came next.

And yet, I look back at the spark that brought me to PwC in those early years. It was the desire to more-than-answer the question:

"What's financial modeling?"

Until next time,

Carl

How can I help you?

• ​FP&A Learning: Professional Development Engagements and Individual Online Learning

• ​FP&A Inner Circle Mastermind: Community, Connection and Content for Financial Professionals

• ​The Finance Circle Community: Expert network, learning resources, discussion, Q&A, and more.

• ​Book A Call