In Reunited, Awards Insider hosts a conversation between two Emmy nominees who have collaborated on a previous project. Here, we speak with Pose star Billy Porter and Mare of Easttown’s Evan Peters, who previously worked together on the first season of Pose and American Horror Story: Apocalypse.
Billy Porter jumps on the Zoom call with one mission: to make sure Evan Peters is doing ok. Porter is concerned because he knows that Peters is currently filming the Netflix series Monster, in which he plays serial killer Jeffrey Dahmer. “I just want to make sure that you’re taking care of yourself,” says Porter. “It’s a dark space.”
Peters insists that he is. But the theme of mental health and the toll of working on weighty projects remains a through line in the pair’s conversation about their Emmy-nominated roles. Porter, 51, is up for his third nomination for playing Pray Tell in Pose (he won in 2019) while Peters, 34, earned his first Emmy nomination this year for starring in HBO’s Mare of Easttown as Detective Colin Zabel. The pair met as stars on the first season of FX’s Pose, in which Peters played Stan Bowes, a family man who has a secret affair with Angel [Indya Moore], which introduces him to the New York City ball scene.
Both actors are nominated for roles that have catapulted them into a new sphere of fame, critical acclaim, and power—and Porter, especially, has no plans to let any of that go to waste.
Vanity Fair: What do you remember about the first time you met? I assume it was for the first season of Pose?
Billy Porter: The first time we met was the first couple of days of shooting. We were in some really remote place in Brooklyn or Queens. I think you were shooting a pier scene and I think I was there to have a costume fitting or something, but you came out of the trailer and I introduced myself because I had been watching American Horror Story. I was just so excited to be in the space of Ryan Murphy, because Evan, you come with pedigree, like you’ve been in the Ryan Murphy universe for a while. And one of the things that I’ve loved about Ryan Murphy even before I started working with him is that I recognize that he has a loyalty component to him that is really powerful and really important.
And so seeing you that day and seeing you on the show and knowing that you were in the family, it was like, “Oh, I’m in the family, like this is the family that I’ve wanted to be in.” I spoke this into the universe, I put Ryan Murphy on my vision board, I’m here. I didn’t have any scenes with you and that was sad for me because I just think you’re an extraordinary actor.
Evan Peters: Thanks Billy, thank you.
Porter: I will say, it’s about time! Because you’ve been working on it for a long time, you’ve been in the trenches for a long time and you’re one of those actors that continually amazes me because you disappear. I haven’t had the opportunity to disappear, I think I could.
Peters: You definitely could.
Porter: I think I could. I’m looking forward to the opportunity to do something like that. Talk to me about what it felt like to get an Emmy nomination. What is your relationship to awards?
Peters: Thank you for all of the kind words, it’s amazing coming from you. When it comes to the Emmy, I just feel honored. It’s really just kind of an incredible feeling, so I’m very excited. I hope we can go to the ceremony and all celebrate, because I think it’s going to be so fun.
Porter: It was my first time there in 2019, and what I love about award season is that it gives us all the opportunity to celebrate each other. That’s what makes it fun for me. That’s what makes it not so pressurized because it can really feel very pressurized, it can feel very much like a pressure cooker.
Evan, as Billy mentioned, it’s about time you’re being recognized for your work at this level. Do you feel like your role on Mare of Easttown catapulted you onto a different playing field?
Peters: I think so. To work with Kate Winslet was a challenge—I really think that she’s one of the all time great actresses. So you immediately try to up your game. And Horror Story is at times a very fantastical show, you can go big, you can have fun with it. This felt like I needed to really tone everything down and get more grounded and channel where I came from, St. Louis, Missouri, and that small town and try to make it as real and natural as possible. That was something we all talked about in the beginning of the show, so I was excited to do that.
It’s an interesting role in that it was written a little bit differently than what we ended up doing with it, and there was opportunities to add humor and all sorts of stuff that I didn’t know if it was going to work or land or if it was going to be ridiculous next to Ms. Winslet. It was definitely scary.
Porter: A few people in the inner circle have told me that you’re a bit of a Method actor. Is this true?
Peters: I’m still trying to wrap my head around what that actually means, but I suppose yes. And probably the reason why I didn’t specifically remember the day that we first met is because I was probably in headphones with my crazy wig on and thinking about Angel and [Stan’s] wife and kids, so I try to stay in it as much as I can because I find it really hard to go in and out of it. Some people are fantastic at going in and out of it and I’m so envious of that. But yeah, I do try to stay in it as much as I can. So I guess that could be considered method in a way.
Porter: The only reason why I bring this up is because in my mind, a Method actor is like the stories that I hear about people who say “you have to call me by my character name in between set ups. And I never break character and even when I’m eating I’m in character.” So in my mind, that’s what being a Method actor is, so I don’t think that I’m a Method actor.
But then, I was having a conversation with my husband who had to live through me playing multiple things. Specifically, I did a piece called Shuffle Along on Broadway with George C. Wolfe where I played a black gay man in the ’20s. And then here I am playing Pray Tell and I am actually reliving through a trauma that I actually lived through. And so for like the first two seasons, I was completely unaware that I was being triggered because I was just so happy somebody was seeing me as an actor and giving me an opportunity that was not an easy space for me to get to.
Peters: You’re bringing up something that I wanted to ask you, because your performance in Pose is so deep and it’s so you, Billy. You have so many connections to Pray Tell that I was curious about you reading some stuff going, “I might not be able to stop whatever emotion I’m feeling after the camera cuts.” So I was curious how that was for you and how you proceeded with that process going into this last season.
Porter: Well, the first two seasons I was not conscious of the need to take care of myself. I didn’t know that that was a thing. And then you add the layer of being catapulted to mainstream crossover celebrity for a black queer man who has been literally dismissed from the conversation from day one. So here I am with all of these things happening simultaneously and my personal life was breaking down. And I wasn’t understanding why, I couldn’t understand how to fix it.
This COVID lockdown has been really profound this time because I was able to go back to season three understanding balance, boundaries, and self care. I didn’t even know that I was supposed to have balance and boundaries. Because this business is so all encompassing, you have to give more than 100% at all times. What I was doing prior to this was unsustainable. Now, I know when to say no. Going into work on episode two, season three when I’m breaking up with Ricky, I know now that I can tell the director, “You got three takes. I can’t do it more than three times. And I will give it to you full out. So set these cameras up and capture the performance.”
Peters: And he did.
Porter: And he did. And that’s why I wanted to talk about Monster and just make sure that you’re taking care of yourself. That was my biggest goal, when I found out I was going to be talking to you, I was like, “I just want to make sure that he’s taking care of himself,” because that’s a dark ass place.
Peters: Thank you, yes. I really appreciate that. I’m good. One thing you said was about balance. Balance, it’s so hard in this business because it is all encompassing and all or nothing and it’s really hard to maintain a personal life and a healthy state of mind and self care within all that when you’re trying to give it 120%. So yeah, the pandemic taught me that as well.
Porter: It’s really a constant journey. I’m directing my first feature film right now and I don’t know if I would have been able to have the presence that I have and feel as comfortable and safe as I feel if I didn’t already go on that. And to also be able to talk to studios and talk to executives and have everything come at me and literally be okay, like I haven’t broken and I don’t feel like I’m going to.
Peters: You have an incredible confidence that I just love. You can see it on screen and you obviously have it in person.
Porter: Well, you’re really sweet and half of that is a ruse, and I say that for real. I came out on the cover of a magazine on May 19th as HIV positive—the shame that I’ve carried with me for the 14 years that I knew that was debilitating. And a week before it came out I thought, “Wow, I have managed to hold myself together all this time. I’ve managed to survive and exist under the cloud of shame for my entire life. Now that is over. Imagine what I can do now!” Yes, there was a confidence that I have been able to portray on the front and now it’s actually grounded in something real. That’s recent.
Billy, since you mentioned that story coming out in May, I’m curious, what was it like after it came out for you because I know you said you hadn’t really told that many people publicly, or did it not even matter at that point?
Porter: At that point it doesn’t matter. I really feel like the next chapter of my life is going to be something that I could have never ever imagined, and I’ve had huge dreams my whole life. Pose and all of this stuff has taught me to dream the impossible. That was the thing that I wasn’t doing, I was not dreaming the impossible. I was dreaming based on shit I had already seen. I was just trying to be some fabulous, sassy doctor on a Shonda Rhimes show. I didn’t think I could change the narrative completely, be the first of something.
Peters: I was curious about the Pose episode four where you do go back to your mother and tell her about your HIV status, and go to the church and you sing a song that gave me chills. Did you come to Ryan with that idea for the episode?
Porter: Well, the smart thing about Ryan is that he comes to us. He literally asked me, “With Pray Tell, what do you want to say? What would be the top thing that you want to say?” And I said, “I need to talk about the relationship between the LGBTQ plus community and the black church.” I grew up in the black Pentecostal church. Religion is man-made, spirituality is divine. And I’m not just talking to black people now, I’m talking to the whole kit and caboodle. Stop weaponizing your bibles to justify your hate! What I said to them was, “It’s not about dragging the church, it’s not about dragging religion. There’s a lot of good shit I got from that.” I am the human being that I am because I grew up in the church and the flip side of that is, it’s time for people like me to hold those mother fuckers accountable. And I’m going to be the one to hold you accountable, and now I have a platform to do it in a major, major way. That’s power. That’s change. As an artist, that’s all I’ve ever wanted to do.
Peters: It feels like you were born to play this role.
Porter: Thank you. One of the scenes that was the most powerful to me was that diner scene that you had with Indya [Moore] where you talk about the bravery of the community. Coming into this, did you have any knowledge about this community? I’m just interested because you seem to me like a very open and present person, but not somebody who necessarily would have ever been in this world.
Peters: No, I was coming into it with an open mind and an open heart to try to learn and understand the community. I had never seen Paris is Burning. Ryan introduced me to it. I didn’t know anything about the balls or New York really in that time period. I agree that scene in the diner where I say, “You’re willing to live your truth and be who you are despite how society treats you.” It’s just so true. That’s exactly what Pose is, it’s a show about authenticity and being who you are despite that. Stan was just always doing things to try to please and do what society thought was the right thing. I always felt incredibly weak. I saw the strength and the confidence and the purity and the authenticity and the truth of saying, “This is who I am, the world be damned.” I learned a lot about myself and the things that I do that are on a very small scale just inauthentic. So it changed me, being on the show.
Something Billy said made me want to ask you one more question before we wrap up. You were talking a lot about your dreams and opportunities, so I’m curious for both of you what’s still left on your to-do list?
Porter: I am interested in creative entrepreneurialship because I understand as a black queer man that if I want to get shit done I’m going to have to have the power to do it. I’m going to have to have the green lighting power myself. I’m going to have to be the leader of something, just as Ryan Murphy has been a leader in our industry. Whether it’s championing queer narratives or reaching back for all the old divas and regenerating all of their careers.
Peters: I’d like to try my hand at directing one day. I really think that would be an incredible challenge and fun to take that seat. And other than that, just work with great actors. Billy, I’d love to work with you again.
Porter: Whether I’m directing you or whether we’re working together, you’re on the list baby!
Peters: Sweet. Thank you. Yeah, those are my dreams pretty much, just keep working with great people.
Porter: I’m trying to run shit, I’m not going to lie. Listen, I’m here directing this movie in Pittsburgh, my home town, and I met a developer, I’m like, “I’m about to do some Tyler Perry shit in Pittsburgh and open my own studio.” Why not? Pittsburgh is like the Vancouver of America. Why go to Canada when you can just come to Pittsburgh?
I’m looking forward to the Billy Porter empire.
Porter: Baby, I’m trying to build an empire! And you are a part of the empire, Evan Peters. And you’ll love Pittsburgh, for whatever it is that I bring you in to star in. You’ll love it, it’s great.
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