SciFi and Fantasy Book Club discussion
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Book suggestions for December: Alternate History
The Years of Salt and Rice by Kim Stanley Robinson
"How might human history be different if 14th-century Europe was utterly wiped out by plague, and Islamic and Buddhist societies emerged as the world's dominant religious and political forces?"
"How might human history be different if 14th-century Europe was utterly wiped out by plague, and Islamic and Buddhist societies emerged as the world's dominant religious and political forces?"
Michael, did you know your link leads to a review that didn't like Farthing because a subplot is a *gasp* interfaith marriage? (PS Rivka is a Jewish name, usually. The orthodox will cut from their family anyone who strays like that.)
Whoops, I meant to link the book not the review (I've fixed the link).
Yes, Rivka's (who is very definitively Jewish) take on the book was interesting, but not likely to reflect my personal reaction (I am Jewish, but my wife is not).
Yes, Rivka's (who is very definitively Jewish) take on the book was interesting, but not likely to reflect my personal reaction (I am Jewish, but my wife is not).
Oh yes, I know that wasn't your opinion, her review was funny, and not in the ha ha way! BTW I'm Jewish too, and my best friend from HS who is now very Orthodox recently tracked me down and called, and when I asked about her brother and sister, she told me she has nothing to do with them because, oh the horror the horror, one married a black, and one a Christian. Her 10 children have never seen or spoken to them because they shouldn't even know about intermarriages! Okaaaaay. *scratches head*
The Dragon Waiting: A Masque of History by John M. Ford
Lest Darkness Fall by L. Sprague de Camp
And I'll throw in a vote for Fatherland as well.
Lest Darkness Fall by L. Sprague de Camp
And I'll throw in a vote for Fatherland as well.
With Yiddish Policeman's Union we'd be knocking out this year's Hugo, Nebula, and Locus award winner :)
The Yiddish Policeman's Union is great. I am all for that book.
Island in the Sea of Time by SM Stirling
in which the island of Nantucket is thrown back in time.
Guns of the South by Harry Turtledove (the king of alternative history)
His Majesty's Dragon by Naomi Novik (a terrific first novel about an alternative history set during the naploenic wars where dragons are used as weapons by both the English and French)
The Golden Compass by Philip Pullman
Island in the Sea of Time by SM Stirling
in which the island of Nantucket is thrown back in time.
Guns of the South by Harry Turtledove (the king of alternative history)
His Majesty's Dragon by Naomi Novik (a terrific first novel about an alternative history set during the naploenic wars where dragons are used as weapons by both the English and French)
The Golden Compass by Philip Pullman
The Eyre Affair is difficult, because it almost presupposes an extraordinary familiarity with classic literature. I read the first 2-3 chapters and felt fairly positive I'd missed about half the jokes because I wasn't familiar with every obscure novel read in English Lit classes. The concept of the book (and its sequels) sounded great, but it's definitely not for everyone.
I second His Majesty's Dragon. It's an excellent novel. I'm on the second book now and I hope that the series maintains it's entertainment value.
@ Bunny Watson;
Sweet, I'm approximately half way through The Throne of Jade and I'm still really enjoying the series. And based on the second one so far I've already picked up the third book as well.
Sweet, I'm approximately half way through The Throne of Jade and I'm still really enjoying the series. And based on the second one so far I've already picked up the third book as well.
Well, I just heard about this movie from a comiccon video. How about The Watchmen? I haven't read it yet but it sounds meaty and I'd like to explore more of graphic novels.
I'm reading "The Yiddish Policemen's Union" right now. I was curious about a book that never appears on the science fiction shelves yet managed to win the Hugo. It's very convincing alternate history and would certainly give us plenty to discuss.
i've read both Yiddish Policeman's Union and Years of Rice and Salt, and they're both great books - and i write this as someone who feels he does not like alternate history in general.
That said, for a one-month read, Chabon's book might be more realistic, as Years of Rice and Salt spans centuries (or is it millenia?) and contains self-conscious attempts to touch on everything from dialectical materialism to spiritual concepts and scientific revolution. Chabon's book is ambitious, but its more managable...
Then again, i'd be up to rereading either one and discussing, work allowing...
That said, for a one-month read, Chabon's book might be more realistic, as Years of Rice and Salt spans centuries (or is it millenia?) and contains self-conscious attempts to touch on everything from dialectical materialism to spiritual concepts and scientific revolution. Chabon's book is ambitious, but its more managable...
Then again, i'd be up to rereading either one and discussing, work allowing...
At the rate I'm going, I may finish "Yiddish Policemen's Union" by December. Gawd, what a slow book. I'm so surprised it won the Hugo over "Brasyl".
I have Yiddish Policemen's Union checked out from the library. I'm not sure if I'm going to start it though. I may just wait to see if it wins the vote here.
I loved the Yiddish Policemen's Union... but in all honesty, the first time I tried to read it I felt like I was trudging through it. The language in particular made it difficult for me to want to finish it. Regardless, I love Chabon, so I went back to it 6 months later, finished it, and loved it.
I bought The Yiddish Policeman's Union earlier in the year because I love Michael Chabon, but I haven't had a chance to read it yet. I'd definitely vote for that one.
Man in the High Castle is a great choice, but I suggest Ruled Britannia by Harry Turtledove.
I'm reading His Majesty's Dragon right now, and it's a nice light weight read, very enjoyable. But I don't really think there's much to discuss, as opposed to Yiddish Policeman's Union, which whether you like it or not, lends itself to thinking of many what ifs that are entirely possible. In other words, there are inherent religious, ethnic, political, anthropological discussion.
Same thing for Rice and Salt - lots of potential dynamic discussion.
Same thing for Rice and Salt - lots of potential dynamic discussion.
The Eyre Affair and its sequels are wonderful, but I think Michael may be right about it requiring too much familiarity with classic literature to work for everyone. It's a bit hard for me to judge, though, as an English major who'd read most if not all of the books referred to in Fforde's novel. :-)
I'm not a lit major and hadn't even read Jane Eyre before starting the series and was able to enjoy it.
HeyT, I don't think this book would just appeal to English Lit majors. It's pretty darned funny even if you haven't read many classics. The names of the characters alone is hysterical. "My name is Schitt, Jack Schitt." I just think it's a book that's extra special for English Lit majors because it's set in a world where literature is just about the coolest thing there is.
I think it's a book that can inspire people to read some of the classics. I was cracking up when they were discussing the plot of "Jane Eyre" and the ending was totally different than the real book. I'm going to have to re-read it to try to see how it really goes. And, I have never even heard of the Dickens' book that's a major part of the story. Not knowing anything about that book hasn't made the story any less enjoyable.
I think it's a book that can inspire people to read some of the classics. I was cracking up when they were discussing the plot of "Jane Eyre" and the ending was totally different than the real book. I'm going to have to re-read it to try to see how it really goes. And, I have never even heard of the Dickens' book that's a major part of the story. Not knowing anything about that book hasn't made the story any less enjoyable.
I agree Sandi. I really think anyone could enjoy these books. They're loads of fun and at time laugh-out-loud funny.
However, they're a little on the pulpy side... meaning, I'm not sure there would be much in the way of interesting themes for discussion. If you did have a bunch of lit majors to dissect it, you might be able to get some interesting discussions started... but for your average reader, it would just be a fun ride.
So really I'd recommend these books for anyone to read, but I'm not sure they're the best option for this group. My suggestion, though it's a little heavy:
The Plot Against America by Philip Roth
However, they're a little on the pulpy side... meaning, I'm not sure there would be much in the way of interesting themes for discussion. If you did have a bunch of lit majors to dissect it, you might be able to get some interesting discussions started... but for your average reader, it would just be a fun ride.
So really I'd recommend these books for anyone to read, but I'm not sure they're the best option for this group. My suggestion, though it's a little heavy:
The Plot Against America by Philip Roth
I would like to second
The Man in the High Castle
If we are reading classic sci-fi this
is the epitome of Alternate Hist. One of the
first and best.
The Man in the High Castle
If we are reading classic sci-fi this
is the epitome of Alternate Hist. One of the
first and best.
I wouldn't say they are entirely 'pulpy' books. There are a lot of complex issues they can generate discussion from such as cloning, time-travel, the importance of literary culture, consumerism, etc.
Well, some can be pulpy, but this genre offers a lot of opportunity to discuss the significance of various historical events. Maybe we'll even be able to discuss Honest Abe's modest slaves, just like old times.
I've read all of the Thursday Next books and they're fantastic. I think it would be enjoyable for lots of people, not just English majors. There are references that would be missed, but I was an English major and I'm sure I missed a ton myself!
No one has mentioned Darwinia by Robert Charles Wilson.
BTW, for those who read and loved Spin (I did) its sequel Axis is, IMO, a complete bore. Very disappointing.
BTW, for those who read and loved Spin (I did) its sequel Axis is, IMO, a complete bore. Very disappointing.
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Books mentioned in this topic
Watchmen (other topics)West of Eden (other topics)
The Plot Against America (other topics)
Of Tangible Ghosts (other topics)
The Eight (other topics)
More...
Authors mentioned in this topic
Philip Roth (other topics)Eric Flint (other topics)
Dan Simmons (other topics)
Harry Turtledove (other topics)
Alternate History
Here is my suggestion, please give yours in the same format to help me when I make the poll:
The Man in the High Castle by Philip K. Dick